1500 - turnament with Bretonnian allies

[quilinus]

Hi All,

We have returned to the era of Hero Hammer (and, to be precise, Dragon Hammer) in TOW. Unfortunately, our Ulthuan dragons are not the strongest in the pack. We could try to dance around the WoCh dragon/Bretonnian Dukes, but it will be difficult.

Yet, for not so many points (given the restriction for allied contingents), we could borrow a Bretonnian Paladin with Falcon-horn and use it to gain the upper hand in most battles by pinning down any enemy dragons/flying monsters (with a paladin LD8, it will work 3 out of 4 times). With it, we should be able to more or less avoid all monsters and kill the rest of the army or hammer them with Valul's Unmaking until they are ready to be eaten by our star dragon mage.

What do you think about it and the sample 1500pts. list for such setup?

Note:
Illusion is for spectral doppelganger and with SW in avg. only 1 time in 6 mage will not get it, Great Eagles should be used as dispel scrolls in critical moments (charge enemy mages)

Sample 1500 list:
++ Characters [750 pts] ++
Archmage [575 pts]
(Hand weapon, Level 4 Wizard, General, Star Dragon, Silvery Wand, Ogre Blade, Seed of Rebirth, Pure of Heart, Illusion)

Noble [175 pts]
(Lance, Full plate armour, Shield, Battle Standard Bearer, Barded Elven Steed, Ruby Ring of Ruin, Seed of Rebirth)

++ Core Units [379 pts] ++
5 Silver Helms [132 pts]
(Hand weapons, Lances, Hand weapons (Hooves), Heavy armour, Barding, Shields, High Helm (champion), Musician)

5 Ellyrian Reavers [85 pts]
(Hand weapons, Cavalry spears, Hand weapons (Hooves), Light armour, Skirmishes)

6 Silver Helms [162 pts]
(Hand weapons, Lances, Hand weapons (Hooves), Heavy armour, Barding, Shields, High Helm (champion), Standard bearer, Musician)

++ Rare Units [120 pts] ++
Great Eagle [60 pts]

Great Eagle [60 pts]

++ Allies [249 pts] ++
Paladin [122 pts]
(Lance, Heavy armour, Shield, General, Bretonnian Warhorse, Falcon-horn of Fredemund)

5 Mounted Knights of the Realm [127 pts]
(Hand weapons, Lances, Shields, Heavy armour, Musician)

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[WhiteSword]

Mmh, 1+ realm and 1+ bowman no?

[Prince of Spires]

It's an interesting list for sure. I hadn't given too much attention to allies. I guess it could work. I'm just curious if it's a lot of points to ground monsters. And even grounding them isn't all that effective in all cases. For a phoenix with M2 it definitely works. For a M6 dragon? I'm not so sure. M6 is still decent enough to get to where they need to be. Wouldn't those 250 pts be better spent on other stuff? It's a cool experiment though.

As for the rest of the list:
- I would combine the 2 SH units. 11 deployed 7-4 will have a lot more hitting power than 2 separate units. Also, as heavy cavalry, you will have a complete extra rank with 11 models, and you'll have unit strength 22, which is decent if you want to try and break stuff.
- I think you have too many redirectors, with a unit of reavers and 2 eagles. At 1.500, you need 1 or 2, not 3. I would personally drop the 2 eagles, and use the points for something else. Either some shooting to clear some chaff, or some more hitting power somewhere.

[quilinus]

It's an interesting list for sure. I hadn't given too much attention to allies. I guess it could work. I'm just curious if it's a lot of points to ground monsters. And even grounding them isn't all that effective in all cases. For a phoenix with M2 it definitely works. For a M6 dragon? I'm not so sure. M6 is still decent enough to get to where they need to be. Wouldn't those 250 pts be better spent on other stuff? It's a cool experiment though.

As for the rest of the list:
- I would combine the 2 SH units. 11 deployed 7-4 will have a lot more hitting power than 2 separate units. Also, as heavy cavalry, you will have a complete extra rank with 11 models, and you'll have unit strength 22, which is decent if you want to try and break stuff.
- I think you have too many redirectors, with a unit of reavers and 2 eagles. At 1.500, you need 1 or 2, not 3. I would personally drop the 2 eagles, and use the points for something else. Either some shooting to clear some chaff, or some more hitting power somewhere.

The main idea is not only to ground the enemy flyers (which, of course, will still move, but their movement will be limited or could be redirected, etc.), but also to gain full freedom with the main striking force - the dragon. Otherwise, with most armies, it would result in a great duel between monsters (in which the High Elf dragon is not the best) and fights between core units, which in the case of High Elves are... moderate (kind of like during the 6th edition).

Additionally, these are still 5 Knights of the Realm + a Bretonnian hero, so the points are not completely wasted and could be used to eliminate smaller threats.

Regarding the rest of the army:

Large unit of Silver Helms makes sense, as they will cooperate with the dragon (thanks!)
Eagles serve the main purpose of providing dispel scrolls in critical moments (to cast doppelganger).
Reavers - I am considering changing them to 2 units of dart throwers (archers).



@Mmh, 1+ realm and 1+ bowman no?
Good point! totally missed that