Ulthuan

Battle 1 (VC) Dec 2013
Battle 2 (VC) Jan 2014
Battle 3 (VC) Jan 2014
Battle 4 (O&G) Feb 2014
Battle 5 (VC) Feb 2014
Battle 6 (WoC) Mar 2014
Battle 7 (O&G) Mar 2014
Battle 8 (O&G) Mar 2014
Battle 9 (WoC) Apr 2014
Mighty Empires Interlude Oct 2014
New Sky Sloop list, fast/melee heavy Dec 2015
Sky Sloops with two dragons vs WotDG Jan 2016


Welcome to my sky sloop adventure! I'm designing an army based on speed and melee power, which I'll be using for a series of upcoming games. However, I also just bought a house and started a new restaurant, so I'll be pretty damn busy and might not get a whole lot of games in. Follow the link above to my newest games. The only thing my current list has in common with my old MSU lists is the SKY SLOOPS which of course are even better than they ever used to be.
















********* Old stuff below ************

Welcome to my MSU adventure! This list is focused around almost no elite infantry, with lots of fast, flying units and a very heavy focus on shooting. As the list and my playstyle evolve, I'm discovering how to use the units (and which units I need most).


***
Current List: 2496 points

330 Lords
Loremaster – Dragonhelm, Book of Hoeth, Golden Crown, Ring of Fury: 330 "Alexandra the Half-Dragon"


211 Heroes
BSB – Dragon Armor, Lance, Charmed Shield, Reaver Bow, Strength Potion, Eagle: 211 "Carmen"


630 Core
18 Archers - S+M: 200
18 Archers - S+M: 200
5 Reavers - Add Bows, M+S: 115
5 Reavers - Add Bows, M+S: 115


755 Special
5 Princes - C+S, Flaming, Star Lance: 205
10 Phoenix Guard - S, Discipline: 175
Lion Chariot: 120
Lothern Skycutter: 95
Lothern Skycutter: 95
5 Swords: 65


570 Rare
1 Frost Phoenix: 240
1 RBT: 70
1 RBT: 70
1 RBT: 70
5 sisters: 70
1 Eagle: 50



I play with a really casual circle of friends and we care more about fun than winning. Our group is growing quickly, though, and we're looking to start a league/campaign of some time soon! Anyway, don't look for super-competitive games here. That being said, I want to make the list as strong as I can. I always appreciate criticism of the list and of my playing, so lay it on!



***
Units and Tactics:

Any MSU list is focused on one thing--combo charges. To maximize the effectiveness of them, we need fast units, small footprints, and decent leadership (and no frenzy/stupidity/animosity). In other words, movement is very important, and High Elves have possibly the most dominant movement phase in Warhammer. This makes MSU a great fit for our army book, I think.


My list chooses units which will help me win the movement phase and perform well in combo charges. To that end, I want to combine 3 major elements: heavy ranged threat, high mobility/avoidance, and very powerful combo charges.

Chariots
We are blessed with three very interesting chariot choices, and they are definitely growing on me! The skycutters in particular are particularly star performers for me, especially without their bolt throwers (a bad upgrade, I've come to realize). Chariots are of course perfect for MSU, at least my style, because they can fit in small spaces (notably corners), hit hard on the charge (you'll be charging a lot), and have swiftstride and high movement for reliability! They can suffer a wound or two without losing combat effectiveness, which is important since I need my units to not be neutered every time they win a combat. They can also move backward and sideways freely, maintaining ideal distances from the enemy until it's time to attack. They also add to my. . .

Shooting
It's very powerful when you have more ranged potential than your opponent. By forcing your opponent to move to you, you can envelop his forces, whittle them down, and attack when the time is right. This is always my general strategy for every game. I always forget this strategy after drinking a beer or two, but I can at least look back and see where I made mistakes! Generally, I always attack too soon against armies that pose little ranged threat to me. Whoops!

My shooting is comprised of a good spectrum--on the heavy end, bolt throwers provide the threat of single shots, while the Reaver Bow, repeater shots and sisters work together against medium-toughness threats. Finally, I have 52 strength 3 shots in the list!

Magic Damage
I need a lot of magic missiles to synergize with my shooting. I've decided that outright destroying hordes is not important to me--I can weaken them with ballistic skill shooting and whittle them down with magic missiles sufficiently to defeat them in combat. To this end, I've chosen the Loremaster, with a good selection of scaleable magic missiles, plus the Ring of Fury. I also love the fluff and look of this model, and I like the idea that she will be at least somewhat useful in close combat.

The other spells are obviously good as well. Spirit leech with LD9 isn't too bad and may help against strong characters (which otherwise pose difficulties for me). Blizzard will especially help when I orchestrate combo charges. Miasma is simply an amazingly versatile spell. Earthblood is the least useful, especially since my Loremaster runs in a unit of Phoenix Guard, but the ability to heal a wound on something with 2 dice is still good. (in fact, that single wound caused a 750-point swing in a recent game!) Wyssan's, while without any amazing targets, is okay on Phoenix Guard and is easy to cast on 2-3 dice on my chariots/eagles/cavalry/monster.

Combat units
The list is filled out with a few more combat units designed to break enemies on the charge. Dragon Princes, Lance/Strength Potion Eagle BSB, and 5 swordmasters, comboed with any of the chariots, should be enough to win easily against appropriate targets. Archers in 3 ranks can help with steadfast and disruption when needed (when deep enemy units advance quickly down the middle, and I don't have time to whittle them down, archers will hopefully be in a good position to flank charge). The phoenix has many targets against which it can be expected to win very quickly, so it will be up to me to put it into the right combats at the appropriate time.

Anvils
High elf armies struggle to field any strong anvil units, and this list is certainly no exception. However, I do have a few interesting options that other MSU lists may lack. First, 18 archers can certainly hold for a round against many types of foes. They have musicians so can reform 5-wide when necessary. Two units provides some redundancy here. Second, the Frost Phoenix is an incredible anvil against certain foes. S5 monstrous infantry/cavalry, for example, struggle to land any appreciable damage on the thing. S5 infantry will outright lose to it, especially fighting to their flank. Finally, 10 Phoenix Guard, with the possibility of a 3++ save, may be able to hold a dangerous combat for a round or two until aid arrives.


***
Weaknesses

Powerful enemy fighting characters
I don't have any units or characters capable of defeating enemy combat characters in close combat. Carmen, with her S9 charge, might assassinate them sometimes, especially if they are without ward saves. The Drakemaster, if he bears the Star Lance, can certainly defeat moderately tough hero-level characters if the dice gods are smiling. The Phoenix can of course win under certain circumstances. Other than that, strength 5 or greater combat attacks are hard to find in my army, so I need to find other ways to defeat these foes. One method might be to shoot their bodyguard to death and then shoot or magic them down, though that requires time. Spirit Leech is another possibility. The final would be to defeat their unit badly in combat, without even fighting the character. None of these is fool-proof, however!

Fragility of my own characters
I have crammed the maximum amount of utility into my minimum amount of characters. Their versatility and multiple purposes leave little room for protection. Alexandra is my general, a light melee fighter, and my only spellcaster (even bearing my only bound spell!). Losing her is very bad, and her only real protection is a 4++ parry save and the possibility of Earthblood. Pretty scary! Her bodyguard of 10 PG is pretty solid in MSU terms, but still pretty frail by most armies' standards. I can expect her to be a big target, especially since she's going to be centrally located (though not in the very front lines, hopefully).

Carmen is a lone flying character, the BSB, by far my highest-strength attacker, and with only the Charmed Shield and a 6++ for defense! I'll need to be very careful with her against warmachines, moderate-strength shooting (though she can shrug off strength 3 shooting with her armor save), and especially magic missiles.

Grinding power
Elves are pretty bad at this, and my list takes this to a new extreme indeed.

Leadership
MSU armies always struggle with leadership. You'll need to declare many Flee! reactions, suffer many panic tests from casualties, and so on. And your units are widespread so it's impossible to cover them all with your leadership! LD10 helps some with this, as does a highly mobile BSB. However, the position where I want Carmen for shooting and counter-charges is usually not where I want her for Stand Your Ground!, so I'll need to constantly be making tough decisions about where to place her. Additionally, she can't shoot when she marches. Thankfully, Alexandra is designed to be in the thick of the army's formation, so her LD10 should be helping the maximum number of units most of the time (one reason I chose her over an Archmage).

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Hi, new book, new year, new models, new armies!

Playing against my buddy Aaron today, with his Vampire Counts led by the dastardly Mannfred von Carnstein.

-----------
HE MSU 2500:

archmage -- level 4 heavens, Book of Hoeth, Crown of Atrazar: 285

noble bsb -- dragon armor, lance, Charmed Shield, Reaver Bow, Potion of Strength: 211

21 archers: 210
21 archers: 210
5 reavers -- bows+spears, M: 105
5 reavers -- bows+spears, M: 105

5 swordmasters: 65
5 swordmasters: 65
5 princes -- FC, Flaming Banner, Star Lance: 215
skycutter -- EEBT: 120
lion chariot: 120
10 guards -- S, 160

ECBT: 7
ECBT: 70
ECBT: 70
9 sisters: 126
frost phoenix: 240
eagle: 50


----------------
VC Mannfred 2500:

Mannfred von Carstein -- barded hellsteed: 450

Vampire -- level 1, heavy armor, shield, Red Fury, Sword of Bloodshed: 175
Vampire -- level 1, heavy armor, shield, Sword of Strife: 200
Wight BSB: barded skeletal steed, heavy armor, lance, shield, Banner of Barrows: 200
Wight: barded skeletal steed, heavy armor, lance, shield: 150

30 ghouls -- C: 300
25 skeletons -- FC: 200
26 skeletons -- FC: 200

13 black knights, FC: 300

black coach: 200


Spells: Mannfred is a loremaster: Death and loremaster: Vampires. He'd have an awesome spell selection.
One Vamp had invocation; the other had Vanhel's.

I rolled 2,3,5,6 and kept those spells (Wind Blast, Midnight Curse, Comet, and Chain Lightning). This was my first time using Heavens, and I'm thinking it's not an ideal lore against Vampires. Still, we'd get to try these spells out!


Deployment: Meeting Engagement. I won the roll to choose the side and deploy first. I chose the side with the building, thinking to put my sisters in there.

Unfortunately, quite a few of my units were confused by the sudden battle and unable to deploy as normal:

Skycutter --delayed!
ECBT1 -- delayed!
Swordmasters2 -- delayed!
Phoenix Guard -- delayed! (ugh)
Eagle BSB -- delayed! (!!)
Sisters -- delayed!

black coach -- delayed!
Wight2 -- delayed!




the undead hordes deployed menacingly close to my disorganized army. Fortunately, the first turn would grant me time to redress my ranks and get all my units onto the board. or would it?



Aaron of course promptly rolled a 6 and stole the first turn. Yikes!

VC1:



I wondered about his Black Coach movement throughout the battle; he said he wanted to protect it (especially from the phoenix) until it had a chance to power up a bit. Hopefully this wouldn't happen very fast!

He held the Wight back (originally he had thought to include it in the knight bus, but now decided to use it to protect his rear. Ghouls, with their poison attacks, were spoiling for a fight with the Phoenix.

Magic (11v6): Fate of Bjuna on my archmage was dispelled, tying his 24 with the help of a book reroll. This spell could easily do 2-3 wounds to my general! Thankfully I was able to stop it. Gaze of Nagash targeted eastern ECBT, dealing an incredible 6 wounds, and the warmachine evaporated. Eastern archers were understandably dismayed by this show of magical prowess and vexed at the tardiness of their BSB and decided to fall back. VanHel's Danse moved the central skeletons up dangerously close to my general's unit. I saved 2 dice for Spirit Leech, but it failed anyway. Black coach gained 2 power points.




HE 1:




could one eagle slow their unholy advance?

I brought the reserves on, a bit unsure where to place them. Things were getting pretty crowded on the left side, but I figured anything I put to the right of the building would be run over. Archmage's unit dropped back into the building. Eastern archers rallied. Phoenix looped into the middle of the undead formation, threatening some rear charges (either the knights, the skeletons, or the ghouls). Eagle flew to block the knights' advance and hopefully buy a turn or two of shooting. I thought I could isolate the ghouls, so moved up the princes, chariot, and swords in a line to prepare for some turn 2 charges. I arrayed them like this so that a charge from the ghouls would need to target at least two enemy units (right?).

Left reavers circled around the tower; right reavers did similar, hoping to force some march checks. There wasn't much to shoot at on the right side.

Magic (7v4): chain lightning is cast due to book reroll, but dispelled. comet targets the knights.

Shooting takes a rank off the central Skeletons, a ghoul or two, and a knight (I believe).


VC 2:


the obelisk thingy is our comet marker. this game shop has tons of awesome terrain!



Ghouls made a pretty long charge (maybe 9+) into the lion chariot. I think we played correctly that he would need to include at least one other unit in the charge, so he chose the swordmasters as well. This would be a tough hold! Knights smashed through the eagle and I remembered about another of Mannfred's special rules, as he preserved 2 dice for his next dispel phase (which we subsequently forgot to use).

Lone Wight Rider rotated to face the reavers. If i wanted to charge his flank I'd need to take some dangerous terrain tests. Coach backed itself into a corner. Central skeletons charged the building, losing a few to S&S. Time to find out what that vampire was made of! Skeletons in the back indeed failed their march test.

Magic (11v7): comet did not land! doom & darkness on archmage's unit was dispelled. raise dead creates 15 (!) zombies to block any countercharge from the Dragon Princes. Hellish Vigor was dispelled, and Soulblight failed on snake eyes (thankfully). Coach gained 1 power.

In the ghoul combat, 4 ghouls died, putting one wound on the chariot and two on the swords. I lost by 3. Swords broke but lion chariot held!

In the house, I failed my fear test! a couple skeletons died, along with 10 archers. The Vamp turned out to have Red Fury and Sword of Bloodshed. We played that I could nominate only archers to fight, and that they'd be steadfast. I lost big but held on a 9, and the vampire's unit fell back 1".


HE 2:





BSB charged flank of zombies, hoping to overrun into the ghoul combat. Dragon princes into the front. Phoenix decided not to charge the knights (afraid of comet) or the skeletons (I wanted to shoot them), so it went into the back of the ghouls to try to finish them off quickly. Swordmasters rally.

Reavers in the back debated a flank charge on the Wight, but I finally decided against it. I should have done it! I think I had a good chance to beat him on the charge. To make matters even worse, I literally forgot to move them at all. Oops. Other reavers circled around to shoot at the skeletons (but dangerously close to the comet!).

Magic (9v7): Comet still did not arrive! It must be a really big one. Chain lightning was dispelled. A second comet was also summoned, on top of the first. Curse of the Midnight Wind affected the Ghouls. This was a really good spell for them, I think, since it would help greatly against the poison, and they were wounding on 6 anyway.

Shooting: Tons of point-blank shooting opened up on the skeletons, most allowing no armor saves. Entire unit was wiped out!

Combat: Zombies crumbled, BSB overran into ghouls (blocking the Princes, annoyingly) and got to fight again. Ghouls lost most of the unit after crumble, unable to score any wounds. We forgot to roll thunderstomp.


VC 3:




the comets killed a decent number of knights and skeletons, but he immediately healed them back to full strength! I should have noted this in the diagram, but forgot

Knights charged the archers, who fled again, ending up one inch from the board edge (whew)! Knights moved forward 3" (zero due to wheel), leaving them still in range of the comet. Wight charged the reavers, which would be an easy victory. Skeletons in the north spun on the spot and headed back.

Coach pulled into the open, away from the comets and preparing to threaten my fast units. Lone vampire elected not to charge the building again and headed around the building to avoid the heaviest shooting.

Magic (11v6): Both comets landed, but the results were a bit underwhelming (to my mind). 5 black knights and 9 skeletons perished in the cataclysm, as did my poorly-placed Reavers in the middle. Invocation from Mannfred resurrected 5 knights and 9 skeletons (not no reavers, har). Fate of Bjuna was dispelled in an intense roll-off, and a final spell failed to cast (I think?)

Combat: The remaining ghouls crumbled, and my units reformed to face the east.


HE 3:





BSB drank potion of strength for some shooting. I moved the phoenix to invite a charge from the coach, wondering how the fight would turn out. Other units moved to support and to shoot at the exposed knights. Archers rallied again.

Magic (8v8): Curse on the Knights was dispelled (if I got it, I'd use volley fire rather than single shot with my bolt throwers). Chain Lightning on the lone vamp was dispelled, and Comet on 2 dice failed (got a total of 9 after the reroll).

Shooting: Both ECBTs and the EEBT all hit their shots, killing exactly 1 knight each (rats). BSB slays three with the Reaver Bow, hitting on 3 and wounding on 2. Sisters kill a model or two. Still not as powerful as I was hoping as only 7 total knights toppled!

to be continued...

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my MSU army list/battle reports

exciting battle sofar, don't keep us waiting to long for the end

Nice game indeed, thanks for taking the time to post it!
It will be interesting to see if you managed to take enough points from your opponent. The Knight bus is almost 1000 points, and you need serious investment if you want to destroy it - but it seems you won't manage to surround it easily due to the global units placements. The black coach and lone Wight King, you should be able to kill, but I'm not so sure about the skellies and the vamps, if your opponent wants to deny those points...
And your army being MSU, you seem likely to lose a few more points before the end of the game. A shame you lost those reavers with those 2 mistakes!
I also think you should have delayed the sacrifice of your Eagle. On the turn you used it, the knight bus had no real target to charge (so no real danger - if he charges archers in the tower, knights have to dismount to fight...), and if he had reformed after the eagle fight, he would have faced the significant threats (wondering why he didn't, by the way?).

About the Ghouls charge: if they wanted to charge the Lion chariot, they had indeed to charge another unit as well since they couldn't make contact with the chariot without touching either the Swordmasters or the DPs. However, they could have charged either the Swordmasters or the DPs alone - rules make it mandatory to avoid contact with other units if possible, even if that means "less maximization", if I may say so... And for what it's worth, I believe the ghouls could have caused some issues by overrunning the Swordmasters - there was little that could counter-charge in your back field.

Looking forward to the next turns!

VC 4:


the bus is shrinking, but will the phoenix hold the charge?



The coach and the lone Wight made medium-range charges on the phoenix's flank. The solitary Vampire and bus both charged the hated archers, having finally driven them into a corner--and both failed by one inch each! The Vampire suffered a single wound to stand-and-shoot. These charges pulled Mannfred out of position for death snipes on the building.

Magic (10v6): Venhel's onto Mannfred's unit (to wheel them toward the building) was dispelled. Vanhel's (from the Vampire) was again dispelled. Mannfredd then threw 5 dice at Soulblight on the phoenix, which I did not have enough dice to contest! The phoenix fight would now be much more difficult. Finally, a 2-dice Doom & Darkness on the phoenix failed! Coach got 2 more dice, maxing it out with Ethereal and Fly.

Combat: The coach rolled 4 impact hits, with S4 against the phoenix's T5. Two wounds, with one saved (phoenix had 4++ at this time). Phoenix dealt 1 wound to Wight. Wight dealt one in return. The cairn wraith wiffed its attacks, but the steeds somehow managed to sneak a wound through! Thankfully, their Killing Blow rule didn't apply here. Phoenix lost combat by 4, testing on a 5 rerollable. I picked up the dice and... snake eyes!


HE 4:




this diagram isn't entirely accurate--some of my units moved up on the left, and the vampire and knight bus took some casualties from magic/shooting

Princes, Guards, and BSB all went into the (ethereal) Coach's flank. I sent the Guards in to reduce return attacks on the Princes (they would be more durable due to the ward save). The rest of my units rotated around the building some.

Magic (5v3): Comet was dispelled. Chain lightning melted the Vampire and jumped to the Knights, killing one.

Shooting: Three more knights fell to shooting (not in the diagram). Bus was reduced to command and characters.

Combat: I forgot about the Star Lance on the Drakemaster (though it would only deal an average of 0.7 wounds or so). Still, Phoenix (now with +1 Iniative) dealt the final wound to the Wight, taking none back from the Coach. I won combat by 4 and the coach evaporated as well!


We called the game at that point, as we were running out of time. It ended up being a pretty solid victory to the Elves, though there were a lot of very close dice rolls that could have swung it the other way--tying his roll on Fate of Bjuna, archers fleeing less than an inch from the board edge, then several charges on them failing by one inch. Phoenix holding, Lion Chariot holding also all went my way. Still, amazing luck from Aaron at the first turn of the battle, getting a good deployment, first roll, unbelievable magic missile kill on the ECBT followed by panicking archers.

The tight quarters led to many of my units not being very useful, but Aaron also had trouble getting his last unit of Skeletons into a useful position.

I loved the feel of my army list, though I'm not sold on the Heavens lore. Sorry for the delay in finishing the report! I was playing a completely thrilling battle against WoC last night. Glad you enjoyed reading it.

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Thanks for the feedback! I hope the end of the battle was everything you imagined.

The Swordmasters were an inch farther away, requiring I think an 11 rather than a 10 to charge them (hence the chariot choice). I need to look at my BRB, but did we play that right? He rolled the distance to the chariot, then connected with both it and the Swords. He doesn't need to also roll to the Swords, does he?

About the Eagle--you might be right here. I was hoping to pen his troops in a bit for some cometing action; this worked nicely, though didn't deal as much damage as I was hoping. I think I got snake eyes for the big comet, and 3 for the small comet when rolling hits on the bus! Similarly, he overran to try to get clear of the comet, which had been cast by that point. So we were both afflicted by comet-mania! I had just mentioned to him the post by Furion in which he claimed a first-turn comet had slain something like 4 chaos chariots and a chimaera, haha. Strategy!

Aaron explained that his goal from the beginning was to quickly knock out the eastern archers and then swing the bus back through my lines--hence the overrun toward them. Indeed, had they fled off the board there, the goal would have been accomplished by his second turn! He wanted to slide the eastern skeletons back west, behind the bus, but none of that really worked out. To this end, I think more VanHel's were in order, especially with his big magic phases, but he never got any off--something else always seemed more important, and Book of Hoeth proved extremely valuable. I was always able to attempt dispels with one die fewer than might otherwise seem safe.

We weren't very familiar with the rules for buildings and assaults before this game. The building proved extremely powerful (even though only ten models could fire)! I was steadfast, he didn't have much in the way of infantry blenders, and he'd have to fall back each turn, exposing himself to my powerful shooting. Indeed, charging it with the bus might have been folly, as it would have taken two or three of his turns to clear it all the way out, while I'd be shredding his bus with point-blank shooting every turn. When the Archmage was in danger, I could even walk him out the back door. I didn't really understand any of this until we reread the rules for assaults, so it was a good learning experience!

At that time, however, I was indeed fearing a charge from the bus. Since his skeletons were so isolated, I wanted to destroy them and hold up the bus at any cost (hence the eagle). How would you have played it?

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my MSU army list/battle reports

VC player here.
It was a very fun game, although I should have known better than to try and squeeze a battle in starting at after 9pm on Tuesday. Why we do these things to ourselves?!
Any who...like Nicene said I had it planned and set up, just after his deployment (wanted to use this advantage well), to chase the outside archers to run away aka off board or slay early. Spin and set my "bowling ball" bus right down the middle of his "pins". These was a good plan, where I went wrong was over committing to achieve those points. Mannfred was acting more like Konrad this battle:) Clearly after the flee to edge and rally, I should have spun and assisted the ghouls, as mentioned. Had I done so I feel this would have been an easy win (unstopped bus of doom!).
Thanks for reading.

Well... shorter than I expected!
But then, I've never played against Vampires so it's all imagination and hearsay for me...


That makes sense indeed - I just thought the distance was lower due to the diagram.
I believe that according to the BRB, he declares the charge against the chariot first, and since he can't make that charge without contacting another unit he has to declare a charge against another one as well - in that case the Swordmasters. Both units can declare a reaction (so the swordmasters could have fled and the chariot hold, for instance).
As for the range, the BRB tells us:

I guess it would then make a failed charge if he had rolled exactly 10 on the dice, since you would have to charge the chariot alone, which you can't do... But it's not explicit in the rules, so a houserule wouldn't shock me in that case...
(yes, the rule seems silly since you can't charge multiple enemies unless you need it to reach your first target... but if you think about it, if your first target is the further one, you can end up charging only the other one instead!)


Ha, bad luck on the number of rolls on the comet... But then as you mention, the comet is sometimes better as a psychological weapon than a damaging one!


I understand this, but I think the knight bus was a bit overkill for the unit of archers. That's 950 points chasing 210 for 3 turns, not counting possible redirections...


Indeed, buildings are golden for wizard bunkers. You lose a bit of firepower, but you're very well protected and miscasts risks are very reduced (S10 template? Bah, it's only D6 hits since I'm in a building! ).


In the heat of the battle, probably like you!
With all the power of hindsight, I would say: not use the eagle on this turn. They want to charge the tower? Sure, go. First, they might fail - same effect as Eagle, except the Eagle is alive. Then if they make it, your mage is safe (he can't target him if you don't choose him to fight), so the only risk is to flee off the board... Ld 9, it's still a bit scary, but maybe your BSB could have moved closer?
Then, cast the comet between S1 and the knights instead of the other side. If he doesn't charge, either he turns towards you army and he's right under the comet, or he goes towards your A2 archers and you've gained 2 turns - let him massacre your poor archers, he won't be back in the game until T5... and you will still have your Eagle to prevent nasty charges! If he charges the tower, well, he has to endure all your shooting at short range the next turn, and if you get out on the other side of the tower he can't charge his next turn (so shooting again).
Well, that's just the theory anyway, it probably wouldn't have worked so easily!
But still, there's a common syndrom among us HE players to sacrifice our eagles too soon. We have to fight that urge!


Nice to say hello in enemy territory!
I actually wonder if you considered using the map more to your advantage. Since Nicene plays MSU, one of his issues is that he needs space to manoeuvre, but your are much more compact. And it seems that the gap between the towers is almost exactly the width of you units, so maybe you could have used those towers to protect your flanks? No flank charge for Nicene, and your black coach would have made the rear guard against mobile units... I'm thinking of a deployment basically similar to yours, but with knights and S2 inverted (and maybe more packed towards the tower). Knights start further from the enemy, but they have the speed to wheel around your army. Ghouls would probably be out of the march bubble, but if you want to keep them aligned with other units (to deny flank charges/being surrounded), I don't think it would be an issue in this game...
The alternative was to do something similar on the left of the battlefield - use the tower and the board edge as flank protectors, turn around the tower, and smash the flank. Again you'd use the high number of enemy units against him, and the bonus would be that part of his shooting is negated (long range, line of sights, cover due to units in the way...). True, you don't know who has the first turn at this moment, but in his T1 he can only reasonably charge with the dragon princes and the frostheart, and if he charges alone, it's actually good for you - deal with those, and get back on your way. And if you get the first turn, you can even attempt a charge of your bus right now, and start making a mess of the HE lines!

Again, all theory backed up by hindsight and a never having played with or against Vamps, so feel free to dismantle my suggestions!

No, no. I won't suck the blood from your attempt to know what it is to be an undead general.
Those are some good suggestions. But I will tell you this, it is a almost impossible task too stop a "bus" filled with black knights driven by Mannfred from driving full speed at the first units in front.
No but seriously as mentioned before. The best thing would have to stop and turn toward the "points" aka "lil units" aka "msu" in the middle of the map and go claim them.
The defensive ideas you had were sharp observation. I on the other hand was painfully remembering the last game I played my dear HE friend and he slew 4 of 5 blood knights with one bolt! And could thank of nothing but close the gap! And fast!
Was good fun,
bad luck to all you elves,
Mox

I'm preparing for some more battles and making some adjustments to my list. Specifically, I'm changing the Frostheart to a Flamespyre, mostly to try out the model. I have to say the Frostheart pretty much been a gamewinner both times I've used him, so I'm loath to switch, but I do want to have some fun with the Flamespyre too!

This leaves me with 20 points open, and I'm thinking about upgrading some command models. How should I spend them? We roll for scenarios so Blood and Glory is a possibility!

Current list:


Core: 630
**
21 Archers: 210
21 Archers: 210
5 Reavers - bows and spears, M: 105
5 Reavers - bows and spears, M: 105


Special: 735
**
5 Swords: 65
5 Swords: 65
5 Princes - C+S, Flaming, Star Lance: 205
10 Phoenix Guard - S: 160
Lothern Skycutter - eebt: 120
Lion Chariot: 120


Lords: 290
**
Archmage – Level 4, High, Book of Hoeth, Atrazar, ironcurse: 290


Heroes: 211
**
Noble - BSB, Dragon Armor, Lance, Charmed Shield, Reaver Bow, Strength Potion, Eagle: 211


Rare: 611
**
Flame Phoenix: 225
RBT: 70
RBT: 70
RBT: 70
Eagle: 50
9 sisters: 126


2477 points


I could also shuffle points around here and there if needed, though the units are pretty much in the sizes I want them.

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Hello there!
I am curious about the lack of standards in your army when u plan scenerios. If uou rolled up blood and glory you'd be done after one standard and your bsb die. Which is scary to me in an MSU force. Plus I am curious on why no musician on your archers? I would drop 2 from each an add a musician and standard. Just my 2 cents.
On the whole I enjoy the army. I also states re running my MSU force. I like the addition of the chariots. Always nice to add some hard fast punch. Why not drop 1 bolter for a tiranoc chariot and have the trifecta o elven chariots. I'm curious to see how the flame bird works out for you. Jimmy seems to have mixed luck with um. Could be a great asset to dealing with hordes. I'm too scared to invest so many points in a single model, in an MSU force for me that's 15 white lions/swordmasters. Hope to hear your thoughts!

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"So do all who see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time we are given!"

I'll try adding M+S to my archers.

If I had a tiranoc chariot model, I'd give it a try for sure!

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Played another game yesterday against Aaron's Vampires again. The twist: this time, no Vampires!

I brought the same list, this time trying out the Flamespyre and adding a few banners to make up the points:

Archmage--book, crown, level 4 High
Eagle BSB--lance, charmed, dragon armor, reaver bow, potion of strength

21 archers--S
21 archers--S
5 reavers--bows&spears, M
5 reavers, bows&spears, M

5 swords
5 swords
10 guards--S
5 princes--C+S, flaming, star lance
skycutter--eebt
lion chariot

flamespyre phoenix
ecbt
ecbt
ecbt
9 sisters


His list:

Master Necromancer--level 3 vampires (general)
Strigoi Ghoul King--level 1 vampires, sword of +3 attacks, talisman of endurance, red fury, ASF, something else
Cairn Wraith hero
Cairn Wraith hero

30 ghouls--ghast
30 ghouls--ghast
30 ghouls--ghast

6 crypt horrors--C
6 crypt horrors--C
corpse cart--balefire
terrorgheist--infested

His spells: Invocation x 2, Hellish Vigour, Vanhel's Danse Macabre
My spells: Apotheosis, Tempest, Arcane Unforging, Convocation

I chose Apotheosis because I had a lot of multi-wound models and it might help me combat Fear. Tempest looked smart due to his deployment and masses of ghouls. I later came to regret choosing the spells I did.


We rolled Battle Line and deployed thus:


Mark and his fiancee helped officiate this battle! Until it dragged on all night and no amount of espresso could keep them awake. The building in the top right is a Grail Chapel. In the center right is an Idol of Gork (impassable) and in the bottom right is a Sigmarite Shrine (impassable). In the top left was an Encampment of Destruction, complete with a Haunted Mansion (hill)


Compact from the undead, spread from elves. The Ghoul King was in the western Ghouls, and the Master Necromancer was in the central Ghouls, along with a Cairn Wraith

He took first turn and did. . .




VC 1:


nothing whatsoever

The Ghoul King was anxious to move forward, but the Master Necromancer decided to wait for the fragile Elven units to close a bit before making his first move.

Magic was 7v6 and the Master Necromancer decided to bide his time.




HE 1:


cautious advance on the left


and some light shooting

Manuela the Archmage realized she was very lightly defended on the right side. She was scared of the Terrorgheist and so didn't want to move her redirectors there, and so ordered the eagle around to the left flank. The eagle breathed a sigh of relief, realizing that it would not immediately be sacrificed like so many of its kin before it.


The Phoenix didn't want to be in range of the Haunted Hill on the left, which definitely pinched the Elves' movement (not to mention the dangerous terrain there for the Reavers).

Magic was 4v3 and Manuela decided to test her newest spell, Tempest. First, she couldn't remember the correct hend positions, but she quickly consulted her Book of Hoeth and managed to salvage the casting sequence in time. She couldn't send it quite far enough, however, and to her supreme disappointment it missed the foe completely.

Scoffing at such a display of incompetence, the nearby bowsisters, under Noble Carmen's oversight, stepped forward and easily shot down a few enemy crypt ghouls. A few more of the beasts fell to bolt shots and an arrow from Carmen's Reaver Bow. But were the elves shooting at the right targets?




VC 2:


Manuela observes the enemy advance


so fast!

The foolish elves had drawn close enough, and the Master Necromancer could no longer contain his ghoulish minions. They moved forward first slowly, and then with a sudden macabre velocity!

Magic was 7v5. Manuela stopped an attempt to invoke some ancient Nehekian chant, but was unable to slow down the VanHel's Danse Macabre and soon the undead hordes were shambling forward at full speed!




HE 2:


more encirclement, more shooting

Manuela ordered Carmen's flank to hold and continue firing while the Reavers on the far right bought them some time. Meanwhile, Manuela's left flank prepared to fully encircle the undead hordes.

Magic was 12v6 and Manuela prepared some of her greatest incantations. Unfortunately, her aim was still a little shaky and Tempest only struck a glancing blow. Even the enemy Master Necromancer managed to duck behind a walking corpse. In total, only 3 ghouls were shredded by the magical winds. Next, she arcanely Unforged the Ghoul King's equipment. At least, she wanted to, but she was shocked at the power of her own spell! It went off with a painful bang. She was annoyed to discover that he had no armor whatsoever (evidently that's a thing), but she was at least satisfied to see his glowing sword reduced to a hunk of soft dull iron. In the magical backlash, her crown protected her from injury. Despite the miscast, she had a bit of power left and attemped an immense Fiery Convocation but, alas, she could not muster enough control to cast it successfully. What a letdown!

Carmen's forces fared a bit better, further thinning the ranks of the forces now closing quickly on their hillside position.




VC 3:


a few rhythmical chants and. . .


suddenly, they were too close for comfort

The Ghoul King, now bereft of his favorite weapon, was hungry for revenge! The terrorgheist still stayed in the back, however, being held in reserve until the perfect moment. The Crypt Ghouls charged into the blocking Reavers, chewing them into little reaver bits.

Magic was 6v4. Manuela once again stopped Invocation of Nehek, but VanHel's Danse once again sang across the battlefield, and things started getting really scary!




HE 3:


a bold attack--or was it foolish?


lot of charges everywhere

Manuela decided that enough was enough and order her archer regiments to shoulder their weapons and charge! Carmen and the Skycutter swerved across the battlefield to join in the fray, while the fearless Lion Chariot charged directly into the Ghoul King himself.

In the back, the Eagle charged the terrorgheist to lock it down for a turn and also to clear the way for a combined charge onto the Corpse Cart from the Dragon Princes and the Phoenix, both of whom were eager to spill green blood. Unfortunately, the Eagle couldn't take to the air in time, so the Dragon Princes pulled up their charge just in time to avoid grinding the bird into the dust! The phoenix, all alone, swooped into the waiting Corpse Cart.

Magic was 4v3 and Manuela once again attempted a Tempest at the Master Necromancer's unit. It missed and killed a single ghoul. She smirked to herself as ghoul bits flew across the battlefield--she was pretty sure that ghoul had been making obscene gestures at her after avoiding her previous spells.

Shooting was basically point-blank, and a couple more Crypt Horrors collapsed, stinking, to the earth.

The chariots weren't able to build up much speed charging in the ghouls--the Skycutter had to carefully maneuver around the interceding terrain, and the Lion Chariot was simply too close to really get rolling. Still, the Lions ground at their yokes, eager for action! The Ghoul King was only able to attack the Lion Chariot, and things were initially looking good for the Elves. But to their surprise and horror, the ghouls started attacking almost before the Elves could even raise their weapons! Furthermore, their attacks were supernaturally accurate, and the Elves began to fall quickly. It turns out that some foetid stench from the Corpse Cart had seeped into the Ghoul's empty lungs, and they were blessed with speed and deadliness as the Macabre Danse began in earnest. Carmen, seeing this, became uncharacteristically unnerved and failed to fight to her full potential.

Still, many ghouls fell, though the Lion Chariot, alarmingly, died before it even managed to attack! Not something the elves were used to seeing. In the end, quite a few ghouls remained, and the wounded archers' left flank was dangerously exposed. . . And the Ghoul King was thirsty for more blood!

Elsewhere, the Phoenix, attacking ferociously due to some intense magical winds, easily dispatched the Corpse Cart and turned to face the deadlocked battle.




VC 4:


the hated Lion Chariot was destroyed, but this left the Ghoul King with nothing to attack! (I think)


time for revenge!

The Master Necromancer decided not to risk charging into what looked like a losing combat--better to let the Ghoul King die and take undisputed command over the force. Instead, he ordered his ghouls forward toward some nearby friendly-looking headless warriors, looking to add them to his undead collection.

Elsewhere, the heavily wounded crypt ghouls finally charged toward the annoying bowsisters, who tactically fled, leaving the bolt thrower to serve as a speedbump. This move backfired, as the ghouls destroyed both units with a single trampling charge! The other crypt ghouls, finished devouring the ellyrian steeds, tried to chase down some silly swordmasters with tall hats, but were unable to reach them. The Terrorgheist, meanwhile, sauntered toward the phoenix and prepared to unleash a terrifying scream.

Magic was 2v1. Invocation of Nehek succeeded in ressurecting a few ghouls as they prepared to rend the flesh from the halberd-wielding imposter undead.

In shooting, the low winds of magic roll proved very beneficial to the undead, as it allowed the Phoenix to be utterly destroyed by the scream, where otherwise the ward save would have preserved it!

In combat, the bolt thrower was flattened, as were the cowardly Sisters. The two remaining crypt horrors prepared to accept a charge from the small unit of swordmasters in the corner. In the Master Necromancer combat, the ghouls failed to land many telling blows and lost several of their own! The combat was a draw, and the Master Necromancer himself was wounded.

Finally, the Ghoul King's unit was wiped out, and the diminished archers faced the Terrorgheist, while Manuela's archers and the Skycutter reformed 5-wide to face the Master Necromancer and his cohort.

The phoenix's body burned bright but there was as yet no sign of resurrection. . .




HE 4:


the Dragon Princes really should have charged the Terrorgheist in this situation, opening space for the Reavers to charge the ghouls. No idea why they just shuffled instead. . . Dragon Fever?


counter-counter attack!

Manuela ordered her archers to attack the Master Necromancer, while staying safely out of combat herself. The Skycutter joined in, but Carmen flew over to see whether she could sort things out on the right flank, and possibly shoot at the Terrorgheist. The Dragon Princes shuffled about, their steeds growing impetuous. Meanwhile, the Swordmasters charged headlong into the Crypt Horrors, anxious to avenge their girlfriends!

Magic was 6v5. Manuela attempted to channel some extra force into Apotheosis, to fully heal the Skycutter. However, she went way overboard, and the resulting calamitous detonation destroyed 9 archers! The Skycutter, though was as good as new, and even had a fresh coat of paint--elven archer blood! She decided not to cast anything further at that time.

A few wounds were inflicted via shooting, here and there.

In combat, the skycutter passed its fear test on a 9. At the same time, Manuela refused a challenge from the Cairn Wraith and was sent to the back of the unit, barring anyone from using her leadership. We played that the fear test was passed, since it was my turn and I can choose for the fear test to happen before the challenge. Is that correct?

The ghoul unit was battered badly, but a few minions still clung to their ghastly unlife. Elsewhere the Swordmasters failed their rerollable fear test and only managed to tie the Crypt Horrors. The battle would continue!

The Phoenixe's body once again burst into disturbingly bright flames, but nothing emerged from the smoke. . .

VC 5 (final turn; short of time):


a long charge from the eastern ghouls, and that flank suddenly looks about to collapse!


damnit


The unengaged Crypt Horrors finally found their mark in the flank of the juicy swordmasters. Their charge cleared the way and. . .

The eastern Ghouls, perhaps inspired by the nearby Idol of Mork, rolled the 11 they needed to reach the nearest bolt thrower! There was some confusion over whether the machine was in their forward arc--the claw feet were out of vision, but the bow-arms of the machine were visible. With a d6, we decided the charge was legal, the ghouls rolled, and they were in! Carmen suddenly looked very nervous!

The terrorgheist debated charging the Dragon Princes, but decided to charge the depleted archers instead, who fled. The monster was unable to change course.

Magic was 4v3. Manuela dispelled another Invocation of Nehek, but when the Master Necromancer started casting VanHel's Danse for the third time, she recognized the spell and suddenly remembered her school lessons. Though at first she couldn't remember the right words to dispel it, she found an easy diagram in the Book of Hoeth and managed to stop it at the last second!

In combat, the Master Necromancer was finished off by some archers, the ghouls died, and the cairn wraith disapparated. The Swordmasters were annihilated but managed a wound or two. The big ghoul unit, however, crashed through the bolt thrower and into Carmen!

Without the Necromancer to guide them, the undead units on the table began to crumble--or did they? In fact, only 4 wounds total were inflicted: 2 on the terrorgheist and 2 on the ghouls. The undead would fight on!

The Phoenix's flames grew even hotter and. . . still nothing.




HE 5:





the final moves

The Terrorgheist found itself surrounded and finally died a grisly death. Carmen, though she drank her Strength Potion, only slew 2 ghouls. Her eagle also got one, but she suffered exactly 3 wounds and died. The swordmasters, seeing this, grabbed her corpse and carried it to safety for proper burial.

THE END

analysis to follow

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Analysis:

He scored around 1150 points; I scored around 1700 I believe, so the game was pretty close.


1. Magic: Tempest was completely ineffective this game! I feel like I was pretty unlucky with the scatter rolls, but I suppose even with direct hits the spell isn't THAT effective. With a direct hit, I'd kill around 10 ghouls at best. The spell's long range and ability to be cast from combat are handy, making it more versatile in some ways than Soul Quench, but the unreliability certainly reared its ugly head--I scattered in pretty much the worst direction on all four casts, rolling 4-6 inches every time.

I never successfully cast Convocation, which is a devastating spell in the new book. I really preferred the old version, since it was less all-or-nothing, but this is what we're stuck with, so whatever. I suppose I should have been casting it instead of Tempest, but I really wanted to give the template spell a chance, having never tried it before.

Drain Magic would have been MUCH more useful. Although, would it have removed the Corpse Cart's Vigor Mortis effect from the ghouls in that central combat? I actually think it wouldn't, now that I think of it. What spells would have been smarter to choose? Specifically, I suppose it never makes sense to take both horde-killing spells, so I should have dropped one of them for something else.

2. Shooting: this was my first time seeing Crypt Horrors, and I didn't really pay attention to their statlines until the end of the battle. They are designed to soak up shooting, not for combat! I was used to seeing Vargheists, which are the opposite, so I guess I just got confused. I should have been shooting the ghouls as much as possible. (or obviously the Terrorgheist once it showed itself).

3. Charging: I was really happy with the charges I got off. Still, it was more like they appeared in front of me, rather than that I was specifically planning far into the future. I suppose just by positioning my units in flanking arcs and having fast, maneuverable, and often flying units mixed in, the possibility of great surrounds/combo charges is inevitable. On the other hand, I missed the obvious one on the terrorgheist with my Dragon Princes turn 4. Any others, I wonder?

4. Chaff: I didn't get much done with the Reavers and Eagle this game, but sometimes I suppose their control of space is more valuable. They fired their bows a little I suppose. When the enemy doesn't have any chaff, there's no chaff war to win. Was the Reaver sacrifice on the right the correct move at the time?

5. Flame Phoenix: Neither of his unique abilities came into play here, so he was just a worse Frost Phoenix this game. The Frost Phoenix would have survived the death scream due to its higher leadership as well. Hrm. . . I'll try him some more and see what I can accomplish with him.




Some rules questions:

1. After destroying the Lion Chariot, the Ghoul King was out of base contact with any other models. Does that mean he couldn't fight?

2. Does Drain Magic remove the Vigor Mortis effect? My impression would be "no."

3. Do the firing arms of the Bolt Thrower count as being visible and in forward arc for charging? Or do the feet need to be in foward arc?

4. For the Vampire lore attribute, it heals single models (just like the Life one). Two-part question: a] Can it heal wounded Crypt Horrors? b] can it bring Crypt Horror models back to (un)life?


Thanks for reading! I welcome any tactic hints or list-adjusting ideas, as well as any rules pointers or Battle Chronicler tips.

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Hi Nicene,

Thanks a lot for the report and sorry for such a long delay in commenting. I really should spend more time in Battle Reports sub-forum than elsewhere!

I must say your army is totally different MSU version and if you don't mind, I have a few questions to the list:

1. How do you find bigger units of archers?

I understand that in 3 ranks they do not give up their shooting abilities at all, while being bigger and having 21 attacks in combat they can comfortably fend off some support units that otherwise may take small units down. Was that the reason to include them in such numbers?

2. Are Swordmasters not too small?

Personally, I would not feel comfortable with that small regiments. What is your idea with them?

3. Phoenix

It is a great model but I was always worried that due to its physical size it may as well be a good magnet for enemy missiles and spells. Basically, it may attract too much of an attention!

3. Bolt throwers

You have some good shooting already, do you think having 3 is too much?

It seems your opponent went for a ghoul theme. A lot of units that can be tough to deal with due to their toughness (pun intended!). Convocation can help a lot against Ghouls. Sisters will be essential in dealing with horrors too. I am concerned, however, with your combat abilities as you don't have that many assault troops.

I don't quite understand your centre. The right flank is ok because you have shooters there, line of sight clear. But why deploy Archers at the back? Was it because you expected your opponent to rush forward full speed?

In VC t3 it seems that your opponent started to divide his army. He did well in turn 2 when he advanced all together. Never a good idea against the MSU!

Very nice sight with all these red arrows on the diagram! You had a chance to charge the ghouls with Dragon Princes. Was it a flank or frontal charge? If flank then you would easily wind the combat, crumble some ghouls and slowly grind them down. If front, you had a chance to direct some attacks at the necromancer in an assassination attempt. In both cases PG would help too and while it looks like a longer charge it would be worthy a shot.

It seems from the description that your resolved the combat between Phoenix and Cart later than the main fight. If that is correct it might have been better to resolve that first as destroyed cart would not grant the nearby units any benefits.

In your turn 5 you had an opportunity to charge TG with Dragon Princes but you didn't do it. Why did you hesitate? Edit: I was writing while reading so I noticed your explanation in your analysis!

I think it was correct order with the fear check. You do that first, then proceed to combat and challenges.

Good to see that your archers fought as combat troops but I guess lack of armour on ghouls does help to grind them down. Another great charge on the TG later on was a good one too. I just think that small SM units were too passive and if you deployed them in front of the hill they could also act as reidrectors.

Yes, I agree it would have been better to cast Convocation first and then Tempest if you had dice to do so. Convocation is a great spell because it is also a very tough one to get rid of later.

I would not be so critical about shooting priorities. I think Sisters and Bolt throwers could shoot at them and if you positioned Dragon Princes centrally they could defeat one unit be themselves provided you thinned it down to 3 models.

I think you sacrificed reavers on the right too early. You didn't have to do so just yet. Better keep them (and the eagle) behind the hill and pop out when they are needed. If you did that you could have saved BSB and bolt throwers or keep them for longer. I also think you positioned your BSB in an unfortunate way where she was on the path of the pursuing horrors.

You didn't use the Phoenix with his fly over ability so that was a little bit of a waste, especially against ranked units. It destroyed the cart which is ok because it aids nearby troops.

In general you made less mistakes than the opponent, were aggressive and decisive with majority of charges and used the opportunity to destroy the enemy units and characters when they separated. Well deserved victory in my book!

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Twitter @SwordOfHoeth

High Elves MSU - Observations

Hi Swordmaster and thanks so much for your comments. These battle reports (as you well know) take at least as long to write as the battles take to play, so I'm glad you were entertained! Let me address your questions if I can:



I want to use the archers as anvils or to break steadfast when necessary. To that end, I've added musicians to the units for my next games. I think I have enough redirectors, and I don't find units of 10 archers useful for much else other than shooting. With 20+, I can combo charge them. And with the new Martial Prowess, they can fire in three ranks, so why not? I was inspired to try this style after reading an old tactica on this forum called "AHA: Archer Horde Armies" and I've stuck with it, especially so in the new book with Martial Prowess. In the old book, I liked taking two units of about 29 archers for my core. Now, with the reavers, the units have shrunk, but I think they can still fill minor combat roles. They certainly don't paint a big target on themselves; the enemy would be wrong to target 21 archers when there are much worthwhile targets for shooting and magic.

With the smaller unit size, they've gotten less useful. What do you think about one unit of 30, one unit of 10? The unit of 30 will be protected by Ironcurse Icon and Shield of Saphery, while the unit of 10 could be sacrificed without much pain. With a unit of 30, I think I'd move the Crown of Atrazar to the BSB and give the MR2 item to the archmage.



I used to use units of 5 swordmasters in the old book and loved them. They're less powerful now, but also less expensive, so I've been experimenting to see whether the unit can still work for me. I'm going to experiment next time with deploying them 3-wide for better maneuverability and character assassination possibility.

I didn't use them well this game, but I think I just need more practice. My experience with running medium-sized swordmaster units this edition is that they lose, at least if you charge anything in the front. I used a lot of 14-man units last edition, but I don't find this unit very smart anymore. I still think 5-man units could be good as flankers or redirectors; we will require more testing. If I owned a Tiranoc chariot, I'd probably drop one SM unit for the chariot.

The Swordmaster is my favorite unit (I'm sure you can understand this!), so I'm reluctant to drop them entirely. This to me is the best way to field them in this book, at least in this army list.



The Phoenix was a gift from my fiancee so I've decided to try it as much as possible Moreover, I've decided to stick with a very similar list for a while and get a lot of experience with it, while making only minor changes (unit sizes, command, magic items, lore/etc) so I believe you're going to see a lot of that Phoenix in my upcoming games! Also, I love the way the model looks and I like the variety it brings to the table. Finally, it's an undeniably powerful unit that a may help a lot against certain troops that might otherwise be dangerous for my army (nurgle warriors, etc). I like to have a good balance of mobility types in my army, so a few compact elite infantry units, a few chariots, and a few flying pieces. I think it looks good on the table, is fun to play, and gives me a variety of threats to handle a variety of opponents.

Yes, I am suspicious that it doesn't have a good place in a list like mine, since it's an obvious target for warmachines. Still, it's next to several other similarly fragile units (eagle BSB, skycutter) so the enemy attention should be divided. In fact, compared to these targets, its increased cost is reflected by increased durability, and I expect to normally have Apotheosis available to help out with keeping all these 3/4/5 wound models healthy. Against heavy-warmachine opponents, the frosty can probably get into combat within two turns. I expect at least one of my flying threats to be eliminated quickly by heavy shooting, but probably not all three.

If I dropped it, I might add something like: Tiranoc Chariot + 5 Swordmasters + Skycutter



No, I think bolt throwers are very useful in the army. The only reasons not to take four are: [a] I only have 3 models. [b] I don't think static shooting is very fun; I'd rather get to play in the movement phase

Still, with so many things to move and consider in the movement phase, I don't feel guilty having 3 bolt throwers, since it keeps the game moving quickly.



With good combo charges, I think I have plenty of total combat potential. 10 PG or 20 archers in the front with 5 swordmasters, a chariot, and the BSB in the side/rear will be enough to defeat most stuff, I think, especially if I can get the frosty in there. Even better if I can whittle the enemy blocks down a bit (which is why I need the bolt throwers). The trick is getting the good charges, which is why I need to practice. It's relatively easy against an all-ghoul army with no redirectors and a careless move or two by the opponent, but we're all improving together so I don't necessarily expect the same mistakes next time or from my other usual opponents.



Looking at his army, I of course expected him to come to me at full speed, as he had no shooting and very little offensive magic. I would have deployed the archers farther forward, but the left side of the map was restricted by the terrain and I wasn't comfortable moving my flanking units there (was this a mistake?), so I placed them in front of the archers. It was only after the finished deployment that I realized how weak I was on the right side, so I started shifting the archers forward.

How would you have deployed?


It was a front charge for the DPs. I think, combined with the Phoenix, I would have won that battle, but it's never a sure thing. Charging the Corpse Cart was safer, I thought, and it would allow my phoenix to threaten his back lines. For the DPs to assassinate the Necromancer, this would have been difficult. He had a ghast and a wraith to issue challenges, so I'd be stuck with four attacks. It might work, but would be unlikely to kill him in one charge. I should, however, have positioned the dragon princes for a countercharge against the ghouls. I decided to combo charge to try to get the Princes behind enemy lines as well, but I think I should have just marched them. The Corpse cart was unlikely to survive the Phoenix for long. I'm trying to make a conscious decision to play more safely and not take too many calculated risks, hence the attack on the Corpse cart and the reluctance to engage the full-strength ghoul unit without more troops available.

Of course, what I did was also dangerous: the PG might have broken and been destroyed. Perhaps the quadruple charge on the Ghouls (PG and DP in front, phoenix and reavers/eagle in side) would have been wiser after all. Also, I sort of forgot that the TG would probably annihilate my Phoenix in one shout.



If I destroyed the Corpse Cart, would the Vigor Mortis still be in effect for its stated duration (until VC next magic phase)? I think the effect would remain, unfortunately. I therefore resolved the Phoenix combat second so I would know which way to reform the Phoenix (back toward my own lines if the main combat was stalemated, somewhere more useful if I won the combat quickly).



I agree with you on all of these points! Archers were there for ranks, not for combat prowess. They killed 2-3 ghouls, sure, but they provided disruption. Therefore, instead of him adding +3 to his score, I added +2 ranks, plus a banner, (a six-point swing). Add their kills and the archers reduced the numbers of ghouls after crumble by 10 or more, which was very nice.

This is the second game in a row where someone has commented that I sacrificed my redirectors too early, so maybe I need to think some more about how to use them! Perhaps a feigned flight positioning would have been more effective?



Thank you! I will keep writing reports from this list. I'm considering, by the way, dropping the Archmage for a Loremaster (I'd also have to drop something else--perhaps a swordmaster unit, or the skycutter BT upgrade, or the DP champion+starlance). What do you think of this idea? Is 10 PG a big enough bunker for him? Or what about a different lore for the Archmage?

Thanks!

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my MSU army list/battle reports

So I changed things just a bit today and upgraded Manuela to a Dragon Mage! To do so, I had to drop a bolt thrower and the champ/starlance from the DPs.

My list:

Dragon Mage (general) level 2--dragon armor, enchanted shield, atrazar
Eagle BSB--dragon armor, lance, charmed shield, reaver bow, strength potion


30 archers--M+S
10 archers
5 reavers--bows, spears, M
5 reavers--bows, spears, M

5 swords
5 swords
5 princes--S, flaming
10 guards--S
lion chariot
skycutter--eebt

8 sisters
frostheart phoenix
ecbt
ecbt
eagle


His list:
Count Mannfred (mounted)
Wight King (mounted)
Vampire (mounted)

30 zombies, M
30 zombies, M
30 zombies, M
30 skeletons, FC
5 wolves
5 wolves
5 wolves
5 wolves

12 black knights, FC
5 vargheists

spirit host
spirit host
varghulf
terrorgheist

We rolled up Dawn Attack. I was unhappy with my deployment, since I had to deploy everything first (once again), and my archers were isolated on the left flank! Oh noes!

Manuela rolled a 2 for spells so she chose Flame Cage to go with her mandatory Flaming Sword.

Deployment:


wide deployment for VC forced by scenario. would this play to Manuela's advantage?


things didn't look so hot here. Manuela's combat troops were on the right, while the enemy's were on her left. She'd have to order her elite troops to cross in front of slow, giant zombie blocks in order to engage Mannfred. The archer block would be a major target for his forces, she knew!

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Aaron picked up the die, needing a 6 to go first and. . . 6. AGAIN!

VC 1



Mannfred ordered his right flank forward, though his extreme flank was annoyingly restricted by a ruined tower. He made a mental note to examine the ruins after dealing with these pesky elves. You never know what treasures might be abandoned in old places like that!

He knew he had plenty of time while his left flank shambled forward, so he advanced without the aid of magic, instead focusing his mental energy on bolstering the strength of the hordes of undead troops escorting his cavalry wing. He made another mental note to eliminate the incompetent newly-turned vampire he had recruited to lead the left--they'd become separated during the night and would be nearly useless in the upcoming battle. No matter.


the zombie hordes begin to expand

Magic (9v5): Invocation from Mannfred raised 14 zombies and 6 wolves. Invocation from the lesser vampire raised 18 total zombies. Doom and Darkness targeted the isolated Archers and they began to feel very afraid of their precarious situation! An attempt at Wind of Undeath failed. Manuela realized she should have spent more time learning to dispel during her short time at the Tower of Hoeth.


HE 1


the high elves moved so quickly that the very air became blurred and hazy

Manuela ordered quick charges! The skycutter and the eastern Reavers ganged up on some central wolves, while she herself took a crack at some other wolves nearby, but was unable to reach them and instead took personal command of the bolt thrower operation on the hill.

More reavers bravely covered these maneuvers on the western flank, while the shock troops on the east circled across the center of the battlefield--though the river was slowing their movement greatly!



Magic (11v7): Manuela halted the progress of the enemy skeletons with an expertly-placed Fulminating Flame Cage. Next, she prepared her favorite spell, but in her overenthusiasm she poured in a bit too much power! The archers gained immense power, but the backlash wounded both her dragon and herself. So powerful was the explosion that her priceless tiara shattered, without protecting her at all!

Many vargheists died to the empowered shooting, and a few other arrows found their marks across the battlefield.

In combat, the dogs died quickly, and ill-considered overruns saw the Skycutter deep in the enemy backlines. This was fortunate, as a lesser overrun might have resulted in a very dead chariot on the next turn! Whew! More dogs would die soon, the Reavers vowed.


to be continued. . .

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Looking forward to the rest seems like you will have a hard time without any proper combat troops, but i'm crossing my fingers for you

VC 2



Mannfred was suddenly hemmed in by some annoying horsemen. He ordered his forces to charge--first the wolves, then some zombies. But the reavers held their ground! He personally spurred his regiment ahead, and finally they fled--out of range past the ruined tower! However, this put them directly in front of the voracious Vargheists, who also charged. A flee move would send them through the Archers, who were already affected by Doom & Darkness. They fled. . . but not far enough, stopping just before hitting the archers. The reavers were destroyed by the vargheists, who began to devour the horses' corpses while the archers lined up another volley. This was costing Mannfred valuable time!

The terrorgheist swung around the side of the archers, and elsewhere the undead forces shuffled forward on their left flank, stifling the chances for the Elves to cut across the river.


sacrifice of the reavers. a foolish flee move succeeds via luck

Magic (4v3): Mannfred invoked Nehek once again, raising even more wolves and zombies, while restoring the skeletons and black knights back to full strength. Additionally, he created a brand new regiment of zombies in the midst of the High Elf lines! He planned to increase the size of this unit later, using the large supply of fresh corpses in the area.

The terrorgheist screamed, but somehow very few archers died.

In combat, a few more wolves died, but somehow the reavers failed to slay all of them, and they were stuck in a very compromising position!


HE 2


careful repositioning before any real blows were struck

Manuela ordered a small swordmaster unit to destroy the newly-created zombies. Meanwhile, she and the rest of her forces continued to swing around to the left, to confront Mannfred directly.

The skycutter circled around behind the enemy Vampire to shoot it in the back!


high elf shooting begins to score some permanent damage

Magic (11v6): Manuela once again felt the surge of strong winds from the north! She once again attempted to ensnare the enemy skeletons with a flame cage, but the time Mannfred stopped her attempt. Smirking, she then cast another Flaming Sword of Rhuin upon the archers--but the spell was stopped cold by a dispel scroll! Dejectedly, she spent the rest of her power to dispel the Doom & Darkness spell from the Archers.

Even without flaming arrows, the archers managed to finish off the Vargheists. Elsewhere, a spirit host unit was destroyed. Elsewhere, many heavy bolts flew across the battlefield at the enemy Vampire, but somehow, they failed to make a dent! Carmen's Reaver Bow missed or failed to wound, the Skycutter hit but failed to wound, one bolt thrower hit but rolled a "1" to wound, and the second bolt thrower hit, wounded, and rolled 2 wounds! But then we had a big dispute over whether the Vampire had hard cover from his zombies, d6'd it, and I lost. So we counted the shot as a miss


What do you think? Hard cover or no cover? You can see the horse's head and neck, and the entire rider, including the feet

In combat, the zombies died, as did the last wolf. Unfortunately, this left me open to some countercharges.


VC 3


the archers are in trouble now! or are they?

Skeletons charged the exposed Swordmasters, while the eastern Zombies charged the central Reavers. Both units held.

On the west, Terrorgheist and wolves charged the Archers. Wolves lost a rank or two to Stand and Shoot, but they hit their mark with 10 wolves remaining.

On the east, some wolves, tired of being shot, charged into the phoenix guards' flank.



Magic (8v4): Mannfred knew that now would be the time for his most pivotal magics. He began with another Doom & Darkness targeted at the archers. . . but failed to cast it successfully (on three dice. whew!). The rookie vampire tried to cast some other invocation, but Manuela dispelled it.

The terrorgheist screamed, and a few more archers died, but combat was joined in earnest!

The archers calmly appraised their foes, realized they were Undead, and peed their pants in fear! Flailing wildly, they still managed to kill 7 wolves, but the return attacks were devastating. The skirmish still might have gone in their favor until a 6-wound thunderstomp flattened a third of the remaining soldiers! Still, they were steadfast. . . but they fled anyway! they rolled a "10" for their fear test and another "10" for their break test. damn.

Both the wolves and the Terrorgheist pursued. The terrorgheist caught the archers and pursued off the table--it would be back.

Elsewhere, the wolves failed to do anything, but the zombies cleared up the Reaver problem and joined with the rest of the Vampire army to present a unified front.

The Swordmasters lost but escaped, the skeletons opting not to present their flank to the Dragon Princes and the Dragon Mage.


HE 3


time to counterattack!

Carmen drank her strength potion and ordered an all-out assault on Mannfred! She, the Lion Chariot, and the Phoenix all made it into the Black Knight bus.

Manuela swung around to face down the Skeletons, and the Phoenix Guard and Swordmasters on the right moved forward to cover that flank. The Skycutter rear-charged the rookie Vampire. It had forgotten to move last time, feeling safe behind the building but forgetting to look over its shoulder!

Eagle on the left charged the remaining wolves, but the swordmasters failed to rally.


things begin to get brutal

Magic (9v6): Flame Cage affected a unit of Zombies, and Mannfred let it pass in order to save power to stop the Flaming Sword of Rhuin. Manuela saw she was outclassed then and decided not to cast it at all!

Shooting saw plenty of Skeletons die to fire breath, though the bolt throwers couldn't seem to inflict much damage even at brutally short range. The final Spirit Host died to the Sisters, and a few zombies died here and there.

In combat, the Skycutter barely took out the rookie Vampire, and the eagle easily defeated its wolfy foes. Focus shifted to the center, where Mannfred coldly issued a challenge, which Carmen accepted.

Carmen struck first, dealing two wounds. Mannfred struck back, hitting 5 times but wounding only twice, which her armor deflected! Carmen thanked her lucky stars for the frost aura. The rest of the combat saw 5 more knights fall, with the rest of them evaporating in combat resolution. The Wight King and Mannfred each took an additional wound (mannfred starts with 5 due to some special item). It was a powerful blow for the Elves, but would it be enough?

The death of the knights freed the Phoenix from combat, and it spun around, ready to finish off the Skeletons or charge the Terrorgheist, should it show itself again.


VC 4

no photo, whoops!

The Varghulf charged Carmen's flank (but would it be able to fight, with the challenge still raging? just occurred to me now), while both zombie units charged the Phoenix Guard, uncaring about the horrendous losses from Flame Cage. The terrorgheist returned to the field, preparing to scream at Manuela the Dragon Mage. . .


terrifying!

Magic (11v6): Doom & Darkness this time targeted Manuela. The rest of magic was uneventful, though I believe Mannfred cast at least one Vampires spell, healing a wound on either himself or the Wight King.

The terrorgheist reared its ugly head and. . . dealt 9 wounds, thanks in part to Doom & Darkness! Manuela and her dragon, already wounded, disappeared in a bloody mist.


At this point, snow was falling heavily, and Aaron had to leave to pick up his wife from work. So we couldn't play any further. Counting the score, he was suddenly way ahead, but in the coming turns things might have swung back in my favor. The Phoenix Guard may have done okay against the Zombies (especially with Swordmaster support next turn), and the Phoenix would almost surely destroy the Terrorgheist, with the Dragon Princes finishing the Skeletons. It all depends, probably, on the central combat, which admittedly looked pretty bad for the High Elves (unless help could arrive soon, which didn't really look likely). Maybe a flank charge from the eagle onto the Wight King could help finish him off?

Thanks for reading! Analysis to follow.

-nicene

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Loving the Lego marsh! Hopefully I'll get chance for a more thorough read-through when I get home from work later...

Finally got in a battle against Jimmy's greenskins today. He's beaten me the last few times we played, so I was bringing my most carefully refined list! We changed to 2400pts level for this and upcoming battles.


Lords: 315
Archmage – Level 4, High, Book of Hoeth, Atrazar, Ironcurse, Ring of Fury: 315

Heroes: 211
BSB – Dragon Armor, Lance, Charmed Shield, Reaver Bow, Strength Potion, Eagle: 211

Core: 600
22 Archers - S+M: 240
15 Archers: 150
5 Reavers - Add Bows, M: 105
5 Reavers - Add Bows, M: 105

Special: 705
5 Swords: 65
5 Swords: 65
5 Princes - C+S, Flaming, Star Lance: 205
10 Phoenix Guard: 150
Lothern Skycutter: 95
Lion Chariot: 120

Rare: 570
1 Frost Phoenix: 240
1 RBT: 70
1 RBT: 70
1 RBT: 70
1 Eagle: 50
5 sisters: 70

2496 points


His list:

Lords:
Savage Orc Great Shaman lv4: Lucky Shrunken Head, Fencer's Blades, MR1

Heroes:
Savage Orc Big Boss BSB: stuff
Orc Big Boss: riding boar chariot, Charmed Shield, Opal Amulet
Night Goblin Shaman lv2: Dispel Scroll

Core:
34 Savage Orc Big 'Uns: FC
20 Night Goblins
6 Wolf Riders: SSS, M
6 Wolf Riders: SSS, M

Special/Rare:
6 Trolls
6 Trolls
Spear Chukka
Spear Chukka
Doom Diver
Doom Diver
Rock Lobba
Boar Chariot
Mangler
Mangler
Snotling Pump Wagon: Fancy Flappa, Elf Rolla, Extra Pump Station


Deployment



I began the deployment centrally and feinted to the right with the Reavers and Swordmasters, dropping the archers on the west side late in the deployment. I wanted to set up a defense on the left side around the river, redeploying my light troops to that side in the first two turns while the Reavers and Phoenix delayed the east flank and the building slowed everything down.

A few notes on my list:

We dropped to 2400 points. I think this level is a bit more popular, and it should cut down on our game time somewhat I suppose (which is a good thing as we often don't get to finish).

From my basic list, I dropped some archers and settled on two medium-sized units. I dropped the bolt thrower from the Skycutter but added the Ring of Fury to the Archmage (a decision which paid off immensely, as you will see!). I was forced to drop the banner from the PG, unfortunately. The list is now uncomfortably low on Break Points for blood and glory--in fact, we originally rolled that scenario for this battle but had to switch to Battleline when Jimmy realized that his army lost almost immediately! He's going to consider scenarios for his next list-building.

In rare, I dropped the sisters down to 5, an uncomfortably small number but still pretty reliable against Trolls.


***
The Great Shaman took Hand of Gork, Foot of Gork, Fists of Gork, and another spell which he never cast. The Night Goblin Shaman got Curse of da Dark Moon and something.

Manuela rolled [6,5,4,3] and took Convocation, Tempest, Walk Between Worlds, and Soul Quench.

He had +1 to go first and won the roll-off.


Greenskins 1



With a bit of shuffling--a Spear Chukka had to shift sideways as the Big Boss belligerently shouted for it to get out of the way--the Orcs pressed forward, driving the mindless Trolls and the insane Manglers before them.

The trolls split up to funnel around the building, with the Orc lines getting a bit bunched up to the east side as chariots and infantry gingerly stepped around each other.


Magic (8v6):

The Great Shaman used Hand of Gork to reposition his Mangler Squig in a very dangerous spot. The Night Goblin shaman then attempted some spell, but Manuela dispelled it.

In shooting, most things missed or did little damage, but a Doom Diver did manager to take out a poor eagle, causing some panic tests! The Skycutter, calmly observing the crazed goblin smash into the bird in an explosion of feathers and blood, suddenly remembered it had left its bolt thrower back in the armory. It promptly flew home to retrieve it, ignoring Carmen's presence nearby with the battle standard.


prepare to get mangled! I realized just now that the Skycutter fled the wrong direction--it should have fled west, through my whole lines, rather than directly off the board. Whoops!

to be continued. . .

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Interested to see what that Mangler will get away with if not taken care of. 2D6 hits on each of those units will certainly hurt, can probably clip 3 units?

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Nec Sorte Nec Fato - Neither By Chance Nor Fate

X-wing Blog

Thanks! Hope you liked the report.


Well, Manuela was decidedly NOT anxious to see what the Mangler could do, as you will soon discover. . .


HE 1




Elven shooting is effective against the armorless greenskins!

Reavers charged into eastern wolf riders, looking to show the supremacy of Elves at the fast cavalry game. Manuela next ordered all the units surrounding the Mangler to vacate the premises. . . all except a brave unit of Swordmasters, who drew the short straw and must take care of the mangler personally!

Otherwise, there's just some shuffling and preparation for countercharges. The western reavers stood still, in hopes of receiving a Walk Between Worlds spell and destroying the western mangler, possibly drawing out fanatics as well!


Magic (12v6):

Manuela did indeed cast Walk Between Worlds on the western reavers, but it was dispelled by the vile enemy Great Shaman. She was juuuuust out of range for Convocation on the Night Goblins, so she attempted a Tempest on that target and. . .miscast! The Tempest of course missed completely, but Manuela lost a single level and decided to forget how to cast that useless spell. She still had some power left, so she used her Ring of Fury to attempt to fry the nearest mangler squig. The nasty night goblin shaman consumed a dispel scroll to stop it.

Shooting was much rosier for the elves, as the sisters ignited the Trolls and the rest of the elves poured fire into them. The western mangler was shot down by bolt throwers as well. Additionally, the pump wagon was destroyed, triggering multiple panic tests! Unfortunately, the nearby goblins proved uncharacteristically brave--only the spear chukka crew hyperventilated so much that they had to rest for a while.

In combat, the wolf riders mastered their fear of the smelly elves and actually stood up in combat, unhorsing not one but two reavers! The combat was a draw and the boars drawing the nearby chariot started looking very hungry.


O&G 2





The western wolf riders got too excited and unleashed their animosity by charging wildly at the nearby building! The elves were so surprised by this move that they only managed to shoot one goblin out of his saddle as they charged the distance.

The boar chariot charged the reavers, and the trolls charged the western reavers, who fled--through the lion chariot, which fled as well, despite Carmen waving her flag nearby, and pointing the chariot in the right direction. She began to wonder why she even carried that giant thing!

In the center, the combat troops moved forward steadily, while the night goblins in the east, scared of being burned to a crisp, shuffled around outside of Convocation range.


Magic (11v6):

Hand of Gork moved the large trolls right in front of the Sisters, who reached into their backpacks for some more flaming arrows. Then, with a fantastic cracking sound, Foot of Gork was cast irresistably! Gork aimed at the fleeing lion chariot but missed and squashed a nearby bolt thrower instead. Satisfied with the result, he wandered off. The price for the miscast was a wound on the great shaman, a wound on the big boss's chariot, and a hit on the big boss riding it (which he saved with his Charmed Shield). Two savage orcs died as well, and the phase ended there.

In shooting, the rock lobba exploded spectacularly! The doom divers were inspired by this and flew to even greater heights, destroying the fleeing lion chariot and unhorsing another dragon prince.

In combat, the eastern reavers died to impact hits. In the building, the wolf riders, while still mastering their fear, still failed to kill any archers, and they got back on their wolves and rode away!


HE 2


the trick to getting nice blurry action shots like this is to shake the phone vigorously while pressing the button


counterattack!

The phoenix chased away the eastern wolf riders, and then along with the dragon princes charged into the remaining two trolls' flank, hoping to destroy them both and overrun into the chariot (a charge from the savage orcs would have been impossible, since they were stuck behind the chariot).

The fleeing chariot and reavers rallied, and the reavers moved to a better position to shoot the intruding trolls. The remaining swordmasters headed back off to the east to protect the bolt thrower there from the impending boar chariot charge. The shooting units stayed still and drew careful aim at the trolls that were so dangerously close.


Magic (3v2): Manuela wasn't worried about the trolls, so she left that to Carmen's shooting forces and instead opted for some target practice on the fleeing wolf riders. Perhaps if she killed enough of them they would keep fleeing and run through the enemy night goblins! Her attempt on fury of khaine was dispelled, but she cast it again with the ring, and it killed 2 of the wolf riders, leaving only 2 alive.

In shooting, the central trolls nearly evaporated, with only one wounded troll still standing.

The phoenix and dragon princes failed to kill their foes outright, and one troll fled with its life (but not before puking on the Drakemaster!). Both units pursued, catching the troll but leaving themselves in dangerous situations!


to be continued. . .

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O&G 3:


how did this even happen?!



The wounded troll was too stupid (or stupefied) to act properly, but that didn't stop his orcish taskmasters from charging forward at full speed! The phoenix and the nearby reavers (losing one rider to the river) fled from the Big Boss chariot, and the 2 remaining dragon princes fled from the savage orcs. The bolt thrower crew bravely stood its ground as the eastern boar chariot crashed into it, deftly avoiding all the trees in the way.

The eastern wolf riders rallied and returned to the battle, but the western ones fled across the river. One of them drowned and his buddy decided to head for the hills!


Magic (12v6): The great shaman prepared his deadliest magic once again. First, he conjured yet another Foot of Gork, which Manuela was unable to stop. This time, it missed, and Gork, disappointed, wandered away. The Big Boss used his Ruby Ring of Ruin to fry two bowsisters, and then the Hand of Gork was once again unleashed, teleporting the savage orcs into the teeth of the elven army!

In shooting, the phoenix was lightly wounded, and two more sisters died to a doom diver strike.

The boar chariot smashed the bolt thrower and turned to set its sights on the nearby swordmasters!



HE 3:





Carmen drank her strength potion and charged the Big Boss chariot. The swordmasters bravely charged the boar chariot.

The fleeing troops all rallied, and the reavers once again prepared to unleash hot doom upon their foes. Manuela considered ordering them north to attack the enemy warmachines, but the threat of fanatics forced her to keep them safe on this side of the battle.

One lone sister honored her fallen comrades by choosing an honorable death and blocking the savage orcs, allowing her allies time to prepare for the coming fight. Manuela exited the building to get into range of the savage orcs for Fury of Khaine.


Magic (9v5): Convocation from Manuela could not be stopped, and 5 savage orcs fried. Then, castings of Fury of Khaine killed 2, then 5 more, for 12 total dead orcs! Shooting added a few more wounds, and only about 20 of the original 34 orcs were left alive.

The swordmasters fanatically hacked at the boar chariot, nearly destroying it! It fled for the hills, leaving the swordmasters to face back toward the savage orcs. Carmen, meanwhile, accepted her foe's challenge and lanced him directly through the heart! The empty chariot tried to flee through the central tower, but crashed, suffering 3 more wounds (enough to destroy it!).

I was pretty lucky here; it failed its dangerous terrain test after I chose to reform my BSB. We forgot to test the Night Goblins for panic here, unfortunately! Actually, where does the chariot's destruction actually occur? Where it enters the impassable terrain, or where it stops its movement?


O&G 4:





The savage orcs charged the lone bowsister. Also, the rallied wolf riders made a long charge into Carmen, looking to delay her! The boar chariot failed to rally and fled off the board. Finally, the troll, now under the guidance of its general and BSB, charged the flank of the phoenix!


Magic (9v6):

Foot of gork on 6 dice was dispelled irresistably! Curse of da Bad Moon from the night goblin shaman was cast at the reavers, and it traveled through the reavers, troll, and phoenix, but it failed to deal any wounds. Invocation burned again, destroying 7 more orcs! jimmy forgot to dispel it. By way of karma, I just realized we forgot about Curse of da Bad Moon after this turn; it should have been bouncing around somewhere I suppose!

In shooting, a miracle shot from the western spear chukka skewered all four reavers! Wow. Almost as awesome as the time I skewered four Blood Knights with a single bolt.

In combat, the wolf riders held their own against Carmen, only losing two members. The troll, however, was squashed, as was the bowsister.


HE 4:


no photo available

The elves used the time bought by the bowsister's sacrifice to surround the savage orcs. Manuela joined the archer anvil in the river.


Magic (10v5): Ring of Fury came up snake eyes on two dice, failing to cast. Fury of Khaine killed 3 savage orcs, and Walk Between Worlds was cast just for the ward save, since she expected the savage orcs to try a final charge against the archer anvil.. this was really bad; I realized later that I was inviting disaster by putting my anvil on a river! The Great Shaman, seeing his chance, rolled all five dispel dice to dispel Convocation!

In shooting, a few more orcs died, leaving 9 alive, plus the two characters. Plenty to wreak havoc in the high elf lines!


O&G


whoops! placing an anvil unit in a river is a terrible idea.


oh yeeeeaaaah!!

The savage orcs charged the archers, losing only 2 orcs to the stand-and-shoot reaction. Manuela suddenly realized she might be in huge trouble!


Magic (4v3): The great shaman mumbled some mumbo-jumbo, and he cast Fists of Gork! Now he had 6 attacks at strength 7, weapon skill 10 (from the fencer's blades). And he was staring Manuela in the face.

In shooting, another awesome spear chukka bolt took out three swordmasters.

In combat, the archers attacked first. 22 attacks, 16 hits, and a massive 9 wounds! None were saved with the 5+ ward, so the rank and file were destroyed! Unbelievable. Manuela went next, and with her one attack got a wound past the great shaman's ward save (5 to hit, 6 to wound, 5+ save). Next, the Battle Standard attacked archers, killing only 1! Finally, the great shaman swung at Manuela 6 times, hit 3 times, wounded all 3 times, and. . .Manuela saved all 3! Even without rank bonus, the archers won by 5, and the two lone characters fled in humiliation and ignominy.

wow, that combat could really have gone the other way! I was really panicking when I remembered that my units would lose rank bonus and steadfast in that river--no idea why I opted to invite that charge, when I could probably destroy the unit with magic and shooting instead! Suppose the archers hit 15 times, wounded 5 times, and killed only 3 orcs. 13 attacks back kill 3 archers, Manuela takes a wound or two, and the BSB kills 2. Suddenly I lose by 7 and flee off the table! He would pursue me off the table, making him immune to my shooting and magic for a turn. Fortunately, the archers really turned on the heat when it counted!

We called the game after this fight, as on my turn I could chase the fleeing characters off the table.


High Elf Victory! I think the score was something like 700-2100.


analysis to follow

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Nice report, congrats on the win! It seems Carmen the BSB does very well mounted on the Eagle. I was wondering how you are finding Crown of Atrazar on the Archmage, in general, do you think it's enough protection? I can't afford TalPres in my list, so am going with Crown, but haven't yet had enough games to judge the effectiveness.

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Rise of the Anointed - Battle Reports
W 1 : L 0 : D 0

Thanks! I love the Eagle BSB. For 50 points, great mobility, extra wound, extra toughness, even some decent extra attacks (the eagle killed two wolves in the last round of combat there, allowing Carmen to charge the fleeing characters off the board in my turn 5). If I had 5 more points, I'd give Carmen's eagle Swiftsense. Defense is of course your main concern. I kept her out of range of both Doom Divers almost the whole game this time, and out of line of sight of the Rock Lobba as much as possible. You can also have her join units temporarily if you are worried about BS shooting, or for example if you want her Reaver Bow to benefit from Hand of Glory on a block of archers! The Lance-Potion of Strength build is much, much better than the Star Lance or the Sword of Might, in my opinion. With a character like this, you rarely fight more than one combat in a game.

In 4-5 games with it, the Crown of Atrazar hasn't saved Archmage Manuela's life yet. She's rarely exposed to multiple-wound type weapons, so I think the item is better on the eagle BSB, and if I did that I might choose something like MR2 to go with the Ironcurse Icon on my Archmage, since she just sits in a unit of Archers and already gets some wardsave action from High Magic. Unfortunately, the BSB's inventory is maxed and I enjoy Carmen's current build too much to change it.

If I were absolutely trying to maximize this list, I'd probably drop the reaver bow and add the Crown to the BSB. But that's a lot less fun, and the Reaver Bow has been very effective so far.

If you don't have the Crown anywhere in your list, and your Archmage has no protection, then absolutely give him the item. It's a steal at 10 points. But there may be a better use for it.

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I've been considering an eagle BSB for my 'basic' WL/PG list as I find my reaver BSB is often out of range if my combat units are moving forward, or else he drags his bunker forward to be in range, or else he's stuck in a combat unit. An eagle would solve all those issues...but is vulnerable to cannons etc if I'm not careful. I'm thinking exact same set up to your BSB (except I'd really try to find eagle upgrade points), which only means switching enchanted shield from my build. It looks fun and what I've seen here hasn't discouraged me .

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The 9th Age: Alumni

Former Roles: Advisory Board, HR, Moderator and Highborn Elves Army Support

Battle 5: teaser

I'm playing against Aaron's VC again this evening. I've decided to change my Archmage to a Loremaster for this battle, to try it out. Everything else is pretty similar, except I've made a couple adjustments to the PG to bunker my new general.

330 Lords
Loremaster – Book of Hoeth, Preservation: 330


216 Heroes
BSB – Dragon Armor, Lance, Charmed Shield, Reaver Bow, Strength Potion, Eagle, Talons: 216


630 Core
19 Archers - S+M: 210
19 Archers - S+M: 210
5 Reavers - Add Bows, M: 105
5 Reavers - Add Bows, M: 105


740 Special
5 Swords: 65
5 Swords: 65
5 Princes - C+S, Flaming, Star Lance: 205
11 Phoenix Guard - S, Discipline: 190
Lothern Skycutter: 95
Lion Chariot: 120


584 Rare
1 Frost Phoenix: 240
1 RBT: 70
1 RBT: 70
1 RBT: 70
1 Eagle: 50
6 sisters: 84

2500 points


And a photo of Alexandra, my new Loremaster:

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my MSU army list/battle reports

Aaron showed up with something new today. He had:

Lord on Zombie Dragon - Glittering Scales, Sword of Terrorgheist-style Scream, Dragonbane Gem
Necromancer level 1
Necromancer level 1 with Rod of Flaming Death (sweet freaking item)
Necromancer level 1
Konrad von Carstein
Tomb Banshee

25 Zombies
25 Zombies
25 Zombies
25 Skeletons - FC
25 Ghouls - Ghast
10 Dire Wolves
10 Dire Wolves

2 Bat Swarms
2 Bat Swarms
10 Hexwraiths
Corpse Cart

We rolled up Battle for the Pass and deployed thus:



Loremaster Alexandra's forces landed on this beach and attacked the Vampire sylvanian homeland. To the left was a Temple of Skulls atop a hill. To the right was a Nehekharan Sphinx. Center was a tower. In the distance were two mysterious forest and a ruined castle wall.


banshee and necromancer in Z1. necromancer in S. necromancer in Z2. Konrad in Z3.

The Vampire Lord had Raise Dead. The three necromancers all took Invocation of Nehek. Konrad doesn't do magic.
Alexandra of course had memorized all 8 signature spells for this day and was eager to apply her many centuries of research to an actual battle situation!

Unfortunately, she'd need to wait, because the Vampires had been lying in wait and took the first turn!





***
VC 1:


man, we really should have rotated that ocean tile 180 degrees. Looking at it now, I see that it's backward!

This was the first time the Vampire Lord had ever been attacked in his home territory! These scrawny newcomers from across the ocean would pay the price in blood. He compelled his mindless thralls forward, closing off any hope for the elves to press forward around his flanks. They were funneled onto this narrow beachhead, and he meant to trap them here and drown them in the waves.

He flew around to the south flank to keep an eye on his least reliable minion, Konrad. That fool alternated between fits of utter idiocy and blind rage. Which would rear its ugly head this morning? The Vampire Lord was not eager to find out.



Magic (12v6): First, time to increase the size of his forces. He watched with satisfaction as, one after another, his newly-recruited necromancers began to recite the only spell he had had time to teach them: Invocation of Nehek.

The first necromancer completed the rite successfully, and two ranks of zombies sprouted from the earth to join the most northern regiment. The second and third necromancers, however, began to fumble the words. Imbeciles! Both of them failed to cast their spells. Why did he even bother with these people? Contemptuously, he began a spell to create an entire new unit of zombies, as a means of remedial demonstration. Even this was foiled, as one of the foul elves, still dripping with saltwater, spoke a few words and the ancient Vampire felt the power drain away from him as soon as it began to swell.

He'd begun to give up hope when he remembered he'd allowed one of the necromancers to borrow his favorite Rod of Flaming Death. With a word, the rod shot a firey beam at the nearby flying contraption. Though no visible damage was dealt, the thing was trapped within a firey cage from which it would be costly to escape!





***
HE 1:


i dropped my Phoenix down two flights of wooden stairs this afternoon. I glued it back together, but it was still drying during this battle (hence the ice dragon, which represents the phoenix).

Alexandra smelled a trap and ordered her light cavalry to screen their advance until they could secure the beachhead. Both units of reavers confidently streaked forward, crashing into the flanking wolves without hesitation.

The skycutter she ordered back, though it was buffeted by flame as it moved, in order to clear lanes of fire for her archers and for Carmen's Reaver Bow. Telepathically, she asked the phoenix to circle around to the south to defend against a fast advance from either the spectral horsemen on the horizon or the giant, rotting monster looming behind them.



Magic (7v6): Alexandra sensed that the spectral horses would be a great threat, and they looked somehow fragile to her magically-attuned eyes. She tested them with a very small Fireball, which easily scorched a single rider. She realized that these beings would be most efficiently destroyed by Light magic, so she began to form the sigils for Shem's Burning Gaze, only to feel an enemy presence in her mind. Something ancient was here defending the cursed forest, and it understood rudimentary magic! She lost the spell.

Counterattacking, she attemped to aid her reavers by bathing the southern wolves in a slowing Miasma, but the effect was less than she hoped. Finally, she tried to freeze the wolves in their tracks by summoning a localized Blizzard, but again something interfered and the effect was dispelled!

In shooting, Carmen's forces had much more success. 4 more hexwraiths fell to the concentrated fire of both Carmen and the sisters of Avelorn. To the north, she detected a weakness in the enemy formation and ordered the archers and artillery to loose bolts upon the skeletons regiment, returning more than half of the animated bones to the sandy earth.

As the arrows hit home, the reavers completed their charges into the dire wolves. On the north, success was complete, and the wolves evaporated under the force of the charge. To the south, however, the magics tying the decayed animals to this realm were stronger, and one wolf survived to pin the reavers down.





***
VC 2:



The Vampire Lord seized the opportunity of the reavers' combat failure to teach the foolish elves a lesson in futility. He spurred his monstrous mount forward, looming up huge above the doomed light cavalry.

Elsewhere, his forces shuffled about in some confusion as to what to do. The hexwraiths headed toward the center of the undead formations, anxious to escape the hated magical bows of the elves.



Magic (9v6): Invocation was once again cast by what was rapidly becoming the Vampire's only promising protege, the necromancer leading the northernmost zombies, which regiment was growing to immense proportions. The other necromancers seemed incapable of besting the magical elf's defense! The fools drained so much power from the air in their attempts to best the elf in mental combat that even his own attempt to raise the dead failed outright. The she-elf, now prepared for the flaming death-rod, managed to stop even that!

The banshee in the north unleashed a shrill scream at the reavers there, but it seemed she was still finding her voice, and they were not fazed.

The Vampire Lord revealed his magical blade and used it to unleash a scream that completely melted the reavers before combat was even joined! His frenzy temporarily sated, he reformed to face the foe.




***
HE 2:



The phoenix swung around to threaten the Vampire Lord's flank, while the dragon princes threatened the open space in front of Alexandra.

Carmen and the northern reavers fell back to the northern side to pour more shots into the skeletons, hoping to wipe the unit out completely.


yikes!

Magic (8v5): This time, Alexandra opened up with Shem's Burning Gaze, which to her surprise was allowed unchallenged. Frustratingly, however, only two of the enemy hexwraiths fell from their steeds. She decided to pour more power (3 dice on 10+) into a larger Fireball to try to finish the unit off, but somehow she miscalculated! A massive orb of flame crashed into the spectral riders, completely dissolving the remainder, but a mental reverberation shocked her and she could feel the lessons of her years in the Tower of Hoeth draining from her mind! She managed to regain her sanity quickly enough, however, and though she could not remember how to cast any more Fireballs, she would be able to continue the battle in a weakened state. She vowed to practice more caution in the future.

In shooting, Carmen's forces, unaware of Alexandra's near-collapse, continued to focus their arrows with precision. After this hail of shots, only a single skeleton remained to protect the wounded necromancer attached to that unit. The sisters and bolt thrower to the south, unable to target anything more worthwhile, took a few shots at some hovering bat swarms, hoping to disperse them while watching for a better target to present itself.

to be continued. . .

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my MSU army list/battle reports