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Rules Questions - Purple Sun and Units/Victory Points
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Author:  JoeElf [ Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:03 am ]
Post subject:  Rules Questions - Purple Sun and Units/Victory Points

Hello fellow 8th edition players. I had two rules questions that I searched for and couldn't find answers.

1) How does Purple Son of Xereus affect unique units? For example the Iron Deamon has a dash for initiative. Do they test on the crew's initiative, auto fail, or aren't effected?

2) If a character is in a unit and all the unit models are slain and he flees is he on double 1's to rally because his unit size is under 25% its starting value or does he test on his Ld?

2b) For victory points in the example above do you need to kill all models in a unit including characters to get the victory points? Or is there partial VPs for character and rank and file?

Thanks in advance. Long live 8th :D

Author:  Prince of Spires [ Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rules Questions - Purple Sun and Units/Victory Points

Hi Joe

Answers are:

1) It depends... Default rule here is that it's an auto-fail. A characteristic of 0 (or - ) means you always fail (p10). If the model is a single model and it has multiple values, you use the highest for the model. And with unique units there is always the possibility that it has a specific rule for certain tests. For instance, a skaven screaming bell would use the rat ogre's Initiative for the initiative test (even though the bell model has a I of - ). But it would auto-fail any LD based test, since neither the bell nor the ogre have a LD value (though for LD, they would be able to use the grey seer's LD as long as he's alive, but LD is a bit funny in that way). Hope this answer helps

2) This is one of the "funnier" rules of 8th edition. Once the rest of the unit is gone the character no longer counts as being part of the unit. Which means that he is no longer affected by the 25% rule and so would rally on his own LD. The 'odd' thing is that if even 1 model of the unit would be remaining, then the character does count as being part of the unit and he would need double 1's to rally (assuming you're below 25%).

A side note here, this also means for armies with the ability to raise back units (TK and VC) that once a unit is gone and only the character remains then you can't cast a raising spell on the character to raise back the unit.

2b) The VP for both are counted separately. So killing the whole unit but not the character gives you the points for the unit (but not for the character) and vise versa. It's different for characters riding monsters or chariots by the way (though they can't join units...). The character and the monster are considered a single model. Which means that they both need to be killed before giving up any points.

Rod

Author:  JoeElf [ Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rules Questions - Purple Sun and Units/Victory Points

Great!! Thank you for the reply!

Author:  SpellArcher [ Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rules Questions - Purple Sun and Units/Victory Points

What Rod said.

Pg 176 of Tamurkhan says treat the Iron Daemon as a Chariot, with exceptions stated thereafter, so I suspect it can use the crew's Initiative of 2 vs Purple Sun. The crew's profile is given to allow for close combat attacks but I don't think that should preclude using their Initiative for tests. Unfortunately the Chaos Dwarf FAQ is no longer available to me.

A monster is pretty much an upgrade to a character, paid for together, so it makes sense that you have to kill both to get any points.

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