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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 2:56 pm 
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Time for some musings. Read on to see what I think about the pairings, our armies, meta development and more!


.::. Borås Spelkonvent - Post-Tournament Analysis .::.

This tournament is held annually in Sweden and has in the recent years seen an uprise in popularity. One of our opponents, the ones from match 5, have been going here for several years and could tell us that the amount of teams participating had been steadily rising. This year set an all-time high with a record 24 teams attending: 5 of them taking the long trip from Norway.

As for the Seals, we started our preparations already in May as the aspect of playing as a team really appealed to us. We all had a number of armies and lists we were considering and thoroughly enjoyed playtesting and developing the team composition as a whole. The only army that ended up being taken in roughly the same format as we started out with was the Dark Elves. Both rusty, strange and myself had to go through many revisions and playtesting games to find lists that we could play and that would suit the team.

The pairing process was something we spent a lot of time preparing for. In the end, I don't think we failed in a single match with regards to pairing. True, we made a mistake in match 2, but this was because we did not have enough experiences with the matchups and evaluated them wrong. This goes to show how important it is to know not only your army, but also your enemies. Being able to correctly judge a matchup is crucial. This is a fact I have been stressing for the past few months on this site and blog, because knowing which faction the matchup is skewed towards means knowing how you ought to play. This is even more important in a team tournament setting, as evidenced by our 2x 0-20 losses in matchups we decided to play for match 2. For all the other games, we got the best out of the situation with the armies available, assuming opponents would not make mistakes. We found Dwarfs to be hard to pair, but holding High Elves back was typically a strong move because the hard counters to Dwarfs were usually weak to High Elves: Allowing us to capitalize on an otherwise weak matchup.

Speaking of pairing, from an overall point of view our strategy was typically to have the stable armies (DE + DoC) thrown out to the wolves, allowing our opponents to choose their matchups. This proved to be a good plan as they both did their job (again, with the exception of match 2 where we evaluated DE-DoC wrong). DE ended up with 41bp, with DoC claiming 76bp. For being our typical counters, this is very good. Dwarfs got some iffy matchups, but the nature of this army means you will almost always have this problem. In hindsight, we should probably have looked into more stable DW builds such as Denmark's Gyrospam from this year's ETC, but requiring Strange to buy another 5 copters was a bit excessive. Giving the Star Dragon freedom to choose its strong matchups proved to be highly valuable, I was able to find openings in all 5 of my games and ended up scoring 81bp for the team. It's a hard list to play because finding said openings often requires you to play risky (e.g. I had an LD9 monster reaction test without re-rolls in game 4), evaluate your opponent's counter-moves and play perfectly to avoid losing big points. While I made a mistake in game 1, it was still in my favour and the rest were all, without exception, big victories that greatly contributed to the team. With all that said, we were also lucky not to meet any teams with 2 hard counters to Dwarfs that could also play the Star Dragon. An example of such is the High Elf Deathtrain + Empire Coven of Light. While these are somewhat playable for me, they are impossible to secure big points from. I am unsure what the overall "composition-meta" looks like, perhaps there were indeed few such teams around. Regardless, I would have preferred to have a more stable Dwarf army and a more safe High Elf army (the Dragon is so risky at times when you play for the big points). Having to respect the nature of both armies' weakness cost us too much in terms of what our optimal pairing looked like. If I could choose from a perfect world scenario, I would have wanted to bring 3 armies that could play just about anything to a draw (e.g. our DE + DoC + vanilla-bell Skaven) and a 4th army that is just very strong and stable in the right hands (e.g. Deathtrain in a meta with little Life around): Capable of scoring big points in the right matchup but more flexible than the Star Dragon.

As for our lists, I think they were optimal given our knowledge and assumptions prior to the tournament. Rusty was originally testing DoC with a GUO, but we convinced him to try Horrors + Heralds which really, really paid off at BSK. It turned out to be the most crucial choice we made late in our preparations. His hounds were somewhat ineffective in some games, but this was also largely due to inexperience and in others, they were absolutely devastating. Dark Elves are so easy to build right that there was never a doubt in my mind we had an optimal list here and for Dwarfs, we wanted a shieldwall with a stubborn lord to hold anything that can't kill him or the bsb by magic. We decided for GTs instead of OGs because we wanted to threaten people wanting to go for 10-10 and give the DW a greater chance at fighting the ranged war against e.g. Empire. Playtesting unfortunately did not reveal this to be a weakness, but what we realized was that GTs firing indirectly were hardly ever an issue (they did give us 2BP in match 5 though, I believe) and we really lacked the sheer firepower of Organ Guns. In match 4, strange met Empire and lost all 4 WMs by turn 2, however he still only lost 12-8 so actually losing this war was not as disastrous as we'd feared. Hence, our assumptions were flawed but again, this is due to inexperience and we learned a lot. I think a Dwarf list can be configured to be a lot harder, Germany's ETC list from this year makes a lot of sense in light of our experiences for example. Lastly, the Star Dragon list I brought had 2 controversial elements compared to the builds that have previously been popular: I had a fighty Noble instead of Stubborn Crown and a 2nd Eagle instead of a 4th RBT. I was anxious about both, but in the end this proved to be the perfect setup for my playstyle: In matches 2, 4 and 5 these were all crucial elements to some of the moves I was able to pull off whereas a 4th RBT and a Stubborn Crown would not have helped me significantly.

We anticipated the meta to be largely similar to this year's ETC. By and large, this proved to be correct, but many teams took new and innovative lists that were sometimes obvious, sometimes subtle. One of these made us do a big mistake (yes, I keep referring to match 2) and again proves the importance of having a curveball and actual game experience against strong builds. It was refreshing to see teams try and innovate though, in addition to our own games we saw experimental Elf builds on tables around us and in the top placing teams. The meta seems to be evolving more and more towards more ranged control and multiple threats, however we also see that people are adapting to the ones taking this to the extreme: The super-popular DE build with multiple pegs and tons of shooting for example struggles a lot with combat resolution, so we see certain builds simply dismantling these in terms of solid, pushing power. Skaven for example do this reliably and effectively with a Bell (the winning team had a Skaven player scoring 89bp, one 9-11 loss and then 4x 20-0s in a row), certain High Elf builds (Lifetrain for example) are hard for them to deal with etc. Thus, it is my perception that we see two major playstyles appear: The evasive, hard-hitting, shooting style that DE/WE/LZ primarily play and the more "you can't touch this" based style that Empire/High Elves/Skaven typically play. There are a multitude of opportunities in-between, but what's interesting to note is that every single list competes in all stages of the game and controlling the board, either in terms of movement or firepower, is of paramount importance and present in all lists.

What appears to be the clue to creating strong lists then is to simply out-shoot the shooters while having the tools at hand for stopping the solid lists. In other words, you need a list that can compete with Wood Elves and Dark Elves at a distance while having the stopping power to make a High Elf cavstar fearful of pushing too hard. Alternatively you can try and make a list that simply pushes so hard that the shooty/evasive lists can't deal with it fast enough while also doing the solid game better than the rest. The Star Dragon build I took falls into this second category, albeit with some serious weaknesses (Empire being #1, which is a huge problem as they are so popular in the current meta). Dennis' build, which I faced in our first match, falls into the former.

I believe there is a vacuum here to be filled with the new 50% Lords and Heroes allowance. It allows us to further exploit these approaches. Our characters are often what enable us to do what we could otherwise not have done and it's easy to see that they can open up for new and unique builds. As always, I'm looking for curveballs here and seeing as 2015 looks like it'll be crammed full of tournaments, there are plenty of opportunities to explore this space.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 11:42 pm 
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Again, good reading Curu, thanks.

Very interesting that you consider aggressive lists with good combat res an issue for DE's.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 5:09 am 
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wow start the preperation in may!

I like your analyse and agree with them. Our preperation was that we did some theory hammer 4 weeks ago and builded our lists to take down DE, deamons, he buss and empire.
I think I playtested the most in our team with my one game. We read the opponents armylists in the car on the way to BSK. We where really unprepered this year.. our orkplayer cascaded his level 4mage the first turn the first 4 gmes but with some luck we manage to take the second place. Woould be fun to face you at the battlefield again!


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 12:43 pm 
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@SpellArcher - Sweden's number 1 ranked player, Kaj whom I met in my game 5 at SM (who also won that event) lost 18-2 to a High Elf list which was aggressive with plenty of combat resolution. I don't know the specifics about the game, but I know that the High Elf list was designed to take on such Dark Elf lists (the TL;DR version of it is big unit of Helms, big unit of Lions, big unit of PG and a Frostheart backed by RBTs. Very little characters to make space for all this) and, according to the result, it worked out well (the same HE list also beat the same DE list consistently in playtesting and other games at the tournament, I believe). People have started adapting to it, the DE shooty-avoidance circus is still incredibly strong, but counters are being developed and we now know what can be done. I have also experienced the same in some of my test games. The bus for example, despite only having 2 Nobles which have fairly poor grinding power, will easily beat 2-3 pegs if the characters don't die on the charge as they simply can't cope with its static res: The Pegs don't grind much better than my BSB and I know how bad he is at this game.

@dennis p - Yes it sounds a little excessive but the thing is that I used to live in Trondheim and half our team still live there. Hence we don't get to play together that often but when he heard of BSK it was the perfect event to go to in order for us to play a lot of Warhammer together, again. It's also been on-and-off throughout the period since other tournaments and RL stuff have taken up our time, obviously.

While your preparation was significantly shorter, you all have a lot more experience than we do and, if memory serves, the OnG list was a direct copy of what you took to the ETC (with the exception of the banner, perhaps? Speaking of which, how did that work out?). Your Dark Elves were a bit off, a weaker list in my opinion than the vanilla one, but the Empire and High Elf configurations were very interesting. I'm sure we'll meet again, I'm hoping for 2-3 tournaments in Sweden next year. In addition we'll most likely arrange a 3-man team tournament with ETC rules in June here in Oslo ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 1:55 pm 
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With BSK over, it's time to look ahead. In only a little over a week (i.e. next weekend) I have a Giant Fanatic comped tournament coming up. Having looked at various suggestions, I've ended up deciding to bring the following:

Quote:
Prince on Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed: General, Giant Blade, Dawnstone, Dragonhelm, Heavy Armour, Shield, Ironcurse Icon, 276
Archmage: Level 4, Lore of High Magic, Power Stone, Talisman of Preservation, 285

Noble on Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed: Battle Standard Bearer, Enchanted Shield, Golden Crown of Atrazar, The Other Trickster`s Shard, Sword of Might, Heavy Armour, 164
Lothern Sea Helm: Shield of the Merwyrm, Obsidian Amulet, Warrior Bane, 150
Mage: Level 2, Lore of Beasts, Dispel Scroll, 145 (1CP)

2x 10 Silver Helms: FCG, Shields, 2x 260
5 Ellyrian Reavers: 80

20 Phoenix Guard: FCG, Razor Standard, 375

3x 1 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower: 3x 70 (2CP)
Flamespyre Phoenix: 125 (1CP)
Great Eagle: 50

+1 to start (1CP)

Army Total = 2380


Specific configurations may vary but the general gist of it is PG + bus + support. I expect tons of Elves, hence I believe the Flamespyre is a great addition. Coupled with High Magic this bird is a beast. I hope I'll have time for at least one play-testing game before the tournament starts, but I have some experience with this kind of list from previous tournaments this year as both the lists I took to SM and IS are fairly similar.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 11:28 pm 
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I think Fencer's Blades on the Archmage is superior to the LSH for defensive purposes. I can also swap the MR over to the L2, allowing the fighter to take a more powerful magic weapon. Sword of Might on a Noble actually significantly increases these guys' overall damage output.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 1:27 am 
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What is the comp? I tried looking on the site but couldn't spot it.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 2:12 am 
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Re: flamespyre being a beast coupled with high magic, you mean to double burn (movement phase, then walk them)?

I have never used beasts with my HE, but wildform on those phoenix guard could make all the difference! nice!

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 8:52 am 
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@John Rainbow - My apologies, check this link for the complete comp pack: http://www.giantfanatic.dk/wp-content/u ... 16V14F.pdf There are also scenarios which are truly random, including one where every miscast you get is automatically dimensional cascade. That, on top with a 4PD casting cap and LoS for an infinite amount of characters against the big spells. They certainly don't like magic!

@NexS - The Flamespyre is largely a beast because of what I anticipate the meta to be like: Lots of smallish, weak units. Furthermore, those wanting to build hard units are inevitably bound to go down the deathstar road, which means plenty of ranks to burn. Double burn is of course also a big boost, especially considering an Archmage can cast Walk (no need for boost if you're only looking to burn) on 2d6, failing only 1/36 attempts on average ;)

Beasts magic is something I believe is highly underrated for High Elves. I don't think it can work as a main lore because of its inflexibility, but coupled with another strong, main lore it can greatly add to one's potential.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:47 pm 
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Updated list and some scenario musings:

Quote:
Prince on Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed: General, Giant Blade, Dawnstone, Dragonhelm, Heavy Armour, Shield, Ironcurse Icon, 276
Archmage: Level 4, Lore of High Magic, Fencer´s Blades, Power Stone, Talisman of Preservation, 320

Noble on Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed: Battle Standard Bearer, Enchanted Shield, Golden Crown of Atrazar, The Other Trickster`s Shard, Sword of Might, Heavy Armour, 164
Noble: Dragon Armour, Shield of the Merwyrm, Obsidian Amulet, Warrior Bane, 130
Mage: Level 2, Lore of Beasts, Dispel Scroll, 145 (1CP)

2x 10 Silver Helms: FCG, Shields, 2x 260
5 Ellyrian Reavers, Bows (swap): 85

20 Phoenix Guard: FCG, Razor Standard, 375

3x 1 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower: 3x 70 (2CP)
Flamespyre Phoenix: 125 (1CP)
Great Eagle: 50

+1 to start (1CP)

Army Total = 2400


Scenarios can be found here: http://www.giantfanatic.dk/scenarios/

Game 1 is battleline. Nice way to start the day.

Game 2 is assassination. Basically choose a character, said character is worth twice VP if killed. If the character is not killed however the opponent is awarded its VP instead (not doubled).

Game 3 is where the crazy stuff begins. This is typically a very important game as well, as getting a big lead here can set up very nicely for game 4. Basically it´s either insanely risky to cast magic (all miscasts become cascades automatically) or you play with Winds of Magic that are manipulated higher/lower every turn. Mastering this scenario can quickly be key to performing well in the tournament overall.

Game 4 is also really crazy. You place a forest towards the center of the table. Having the most stuff in this forest is worth 750 (!!) vp. Furthermore the forest can be targeted by spells and if you choose to do this, it moves. Randomly. I don´t know how to approach this, but 750VP is huge.

Game 5 is battleline.

High Magic is a big lore in this context. You can two-dice and 1-dice many spells to avoid the worst of the effects for scenario 3. You have a multitude of spells to manipulate board control and lastly it sets up really well for game 4, where I can see Walk being a game winner.

I´m quite happy with my list. I see no apparant weaknesses in it and am really looking forward to playing this. The only downside is I won´t get many test game before the tournament.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 12:30 am 
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Thanks for all the reports and analysis from the team tournament. Very interesting.

Can't say I like scenarios 3 and 4 for your upcoming tournament.

Dimensional cascade can be game ending and sometimes you get unlucky and miscast on even low numbers of dice (I recall my friend miscasting twice over 2 turns, both on 2 dice casts).

Scenario 4 seems like it gives a HUGE advantage to the player who gets the last turn.

Just seems like random elements will likely play a large roll in these scenarios.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:42 am 
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Hey gaz, glad you enjoyed the read :)

Scenarios are just that: Random. I have yet to see scenarios which encourage more interesting play. They typically just add random events or increase the margin of victory. I will have to deal with them though, so planning ahead and being aware of their side effects is critical.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 4:04 pm 
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Wow that comp is somewhat unusual. I think you're right about using a low-cost lore for the third game. Your list seems pretty decent given the restrictions. Good luck!


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 5:46 pm 
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You need like 5 level 2 wizards.

OnG with 10 level 1 Lore of undeath night goblins would dominate scenarios 3 and 4

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 8:17 pm 
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@John Rainbow - I was originally considering a dragon list as I think it fits the comp very well. However I think this is better balanced and less susceptible to bad matchups. Will be interesting to play :)

@Nicene - first of all the comp specifies you can only take two of each character. Secondly, this comp was made before the 50% change so old rules are in play. Lastly I think taking that many mages is overkill unless maybe, you go for light coven.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 6:34 pm 
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Short report on my first game with the GF list today.


.::. Battle Report - 2400 High Elves vs Warriors of Chaos (Giant Fanatic comp) .::.

My list:

Quote:
Prince on Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed: General, Giant Blade, Dawnstone, Dragonhelm, Heavy Armour, Shield, Ironcurse Icon, 276
Archmage: Level 4, Lore of High Magic, Fencer´s Blades, Power Stone, Talisman of Preservation, 320

Noble on Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed: Battle Standard Bearer, Enchanted Shield, Golden Crown of Atrazar, The Other Trickster`s Shard, Sword of Might, Heavy Armour, 164
Noble: Dragon Armour, Shield of the Merwyrm, Obsidian Amulet, Warrior Bane, 130
Mage: Level 2, Lore of Beasts, Dispel Scroll, 145 (1CP)

2x 10 Silver Helms: FCG, Shields, 2x 260
5 Ellyrian Reavers, Bows (swap): 85

20 Phoenix Guard: FCG, Razor Standard, 375

3x 1 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower: 3x 70 (2CP)
Flamespyre Phoenix: 125 (1CP)
Great Eagle: 50

+1 to start (1CP)

Army Total = 2400


His list:

Quote:

Vilitch the Curseling
Chaos Lord, 3++, stubborn
4++ BSB on Daemonic Mount
Metal Sorcerer with Chaos Familiar

Big block of Warriors with blasted standard
2x5 Hounds
5x Horsemen

8ish Knights of Tzeentch
Slaughterbrute


Pre-battle thoughts and deployment

A relatively soft list as far as WoC go. He was using the Sheffield comp which I was ok with as I just wanted to learn how my army plays. Loading up in characters can hurt WoC a lot, doubly so when they end up being relatively sluggish. Deployment was massively in my favour with me getting the helms uncontested on a flank with PG central and RBTs having perfect lines of fire.

Image

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So basically the Knights thundered down his flank. His Knights + BSB were exposed T2 so I charged them and killed them all. Without a scroll he had to let Wyssan´s through which made my Helms a true nightmare for him. I waked one units of Hounds and flanked the other with a sole surviving Helm after his magic had made its impact. I then solo-charged the Prince at a 2W slaughterbrute, probably a mistake as shooting the Warriors with RBTs was a waste anyway, but I was lucky and weathered his magic with the Prince, losing a single wound. With all his support gone and the Knights smashed, I was able to put up a surround he couldn´t escape from:

Image

Everything charged in and his stubborn crown was unforged. He needed snake eyes, failed, and I ran him down. 20-0 to the High Elves!

Evaluation

Warriors are susceptible to flanking moves when they don´t castle up with Hellcannons and have an army core of slow things. In this game I think my speed caught him by surprise and with his quite aggressive opening, I could capitalize on my formation to crush his flank and envelope the deathstar.

Charging the Prince out at the Brute was a mistake. Should´ve shot it with RBTs.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:29 pm 
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Edit: working fine now.

(The pics aren't working for me. Anyone else?)


Last edited by John Rainbow on Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 2:50 am 
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ok for me :)

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:42 am 
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Curu Olannon wrote:

@NexS - The Flamespyre is largely a beast because of what I anticipate the meta to be like: Lots of smallish, weak units. Furthermore, those wanting to build hard units are inevitably bound to go down the deathstar road, which means plenty of ranks to burn. Double burn is of course also a big boost, especially considering an Archmage can cast Walk (no need for boost if you're only looking to burn) on 2d6, failing only 1/36 attempts on average ;)

Beasts magic is something I believe is highly underrated for High Elves. I don't think it can work as a main lore because of its inflexibility, but coupled with another strong, main lore it can greatly add to one's potential.


That is a fair point. I would like to give beasts a try one day soon... just have to find a list with a second mage....


EDIT:
Good rep. I am always happy to see chaos get beaten :)

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:32 pm 
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@John Rainbow - I tried it in different browsers and had a friend check as well, no issues. Still not working for you?

@pk-ng - Thanks for weighing in, it could have been an ISP issue but seeing as you´re on another continent I guess that´s not the issue here.

@NexS - Building various lists and testing them out is half the fun of this game. I strongly advice you to mix things up. Only this past year I have tried at least 3 very different playstyles with lots more lists developed on paper that I never got to try out.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:42 pm 
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Its working for me at my office. Nice result. As you say though, his is a bit of an odd list.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 8:32 am 
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Yes, the list is relatively soft. I haven't seen the worst WoC can make under GF restrictions though, maybe I will this weekend ;)

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:34 am 
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Thank you for a nice report.

Just a few comments on your list:

Have you thought about using sisters, since they almost work as a bolt thrower, but don't cost you any CP's?
Is is really that important for your list to get first turn to use one CP on it?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:54 am 
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Sisters are a no-go. They are not bolt throwers. They have half the range, less than half the toughness and no option for single bolts. Furthermore I don't expect to meet a lot with regen so the flaming effect is largely wasted. Being able to single-bolt stuff like chariots, daemon princes, steam tanks and monstrous cav is very powerful in this meta.

+1 to first turn CP is very nice-to-have. The meta is elf-heavy and Elven matchups are very dominated by who gets to move first. What would you spend the last CP on instead?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:39 am 
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Quote:
Sisters are a no-go. They are not bolt throwers. They have half the range, less than half the toughness and no option for single bolts. Furthermore I don't expect to meet a lot with regen so the flaming effect is largely wasted. Being able to single-bolt stuff like chariots, daemon princes, steam tanks and monstrous cav is very powerful in this meta.

+1 to first turn CP is very nice-to-have. The meta is elf-heavy and Elven matchups are very dominated by who gets to move first. What would you spend the last CP on instead?


Fair enough. Normally I'm not a fan of sister at all and prefer bolt throwers, but I just think bolt throwers are really heavily comped in this system. 2 CP for 3 bolt throwers sounds like a lot. It's the same amount of CP for a frostheart.
I went to a tournament with this comp system and in hindsight, I think I would go for something like this:
Prince on a flamespyre (1CP)
Frostheart (2CP)
2xlvl. 2 mages high magic and dispel scroll (1CP).
20 Phoenix guards
Silver helms with 1-2 nobels + star lance
reavers and some archers
2 bolt throwers (1CP)
1-2 eagles

You are not gonna see a lot of warmachines and we all know how powerful 3++ Phoenix guards are. I'm also running a list similar to your dragon list, and I don't feel inferior in the magic phase despite having only lvl. 2 high mages (btw. I just put up a quick battlerep against wood elves, with my dragon list, if you are interested). And a silver helm bus with 1-2 nobles with the starlance/ogre blade also hit like a ton of bricks. So you have a really nice bunker and some very mobile hard hitters.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:42 am 
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It's an interesting take on GF. Very interesting in fact. I'll look into it, but first I have to find out whether you can actually spend CP to make the Anointed's Flamespyre cheaper. It's also worth remembering that you only get 2 mounted characters, so only one Noble to go with the Helms.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:49 am 
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What's the thinking behind 2 x 10 Helms Curu?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:51 am 
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Quote:
I'll look into it, but first I have to find out whether you can actually spend CP to make the Anointed's Flamespyre cheaper. It's also worth remembering that you only get 2 mounted characters, so only one Noble to go with the Helms.


I'm pretty sure you can. I played against another high elf player with a prince on a griffon which also got the point discount.

Yeah I forgot about the max 2 mounted characters. I guess it will be a pot of foolhardiness + starlance noble then.
I'll look forward to your battlereports on the event :)


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 12:46 pm 
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I found a couple of variations I really liked, but unfortunately I forgot that I simply don't have the time to paint up another Phoenix before Saturday. It's a pity, really, the model is even halfway done but I know I won't have the hours needed to complete it.

Instead, I've gotten a few very different ideas however. How about this:

Quote:
Anointed of Asuryan: Giant Blade, Enchanted Shield, Dawnstone, 300
Archmage: Level 4, High Magic, Dispel Scroll, Golden Crown of Atrazar 255 (1CP)
Korhil: 150
Noble: Battle Standard Bearer, Heavy Armour, Talisman of Preservation, Halberd, 146
Handmaiden of the Everqueen: Reaver Bow, Potion of Strength, 140

25 Archers: Champion, Musician 270
10 Silver Helms: FCG, Shields, 260
5 Ellyrian Reavers, 80

25 Swordmasters of Hoeth: FCG, Banner of the World Dragon, 405 (1CP)

4x 1 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower: 4x 80
8 Sisters of Avelorn: 112

Army Total: 2398

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 2:11 pm 
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This is my take on giant fanatic fyi, beasts magic can easily be swapped out for high. I think spending 1CP on +1 to go first is mandatory for this comp, if only to negate your opponents potentially doing this also.

Anointed on Flamespyre: Giant Blade, Enchanted Shield, Dragonbane Gem, OTS, 420 (1CP)
Noble: BSB, Barded Steed, Heavy Armour, Star Lance, Charmed Shield, Golden Crown, Potion of Fools, 164
Mage: Level 2, Beasts Magic, Sceptre of Stability, Khaine's Ring of Fury, 160
Mage: Level 2, Beasts Magic, Power Stone, 140

10 Silver Helms: Full Command, 260
10 Silver Helms: Full Command, 260
5 Reavers: 80

21 Swordmasters: Full Command, BotWD, 353 (1CP)
20 Phoenix Guard: Standard, Musician, 320

Frostheart Phoenix: 240 (2CP)

+1 to go first (1CP)


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