Marinero wrote:I am facing a DE game with a really scary build (under ETC rules):
* Dreadlord, pendant, crown of command, dark steed
* Dreadlord, 1+ AS, 4++ WS, pegasus
* Noble, BSB, regeneration, pegasus
* sorceress, lvl 2, item that allows a unit to reroll missed shooting attacks, dispel scroll (shadow)
* sorceress, lvl 2, seal of grond (shadow)
* 35 crossbows in 2 units
* 3x5 DRs with spears
* 2x COC
* 6-7 shades
* 2xRBTs
* Hydra
There are also some additional items, units and weapons I am not certain about...
Seredain, how would you deal with this army?
Thoughts on Harassment-Heavy Dark Elves
Marinero,
I've had a little think about this and figure we should start by looking at this army's strengths and weaknesses.
Strength: Awesome manouvreability and excellent mobile shooting power. It's like an MSU list but it has really heavy hitters and units which can move and fire effectively. Against shooting-light opponents, presumably it plays avoidance, shoots things to hell and uses its powerful characters, chariots and hydra to finish off what's left. In order to beat it then, you want to deny him one of those 'arms' of ability for as long as you can.
Weakness: His shooting has, by and large, only 24" range. His list relies on manoevreability at the cost of lacking much in the way of ranks. Rule number 1, then, is to deploy out of range. Rule number 2 is to deny your units' flank to the fast DE units, preventing him from using his manoeuvreability against you, by refusing to deploy centrally or advance up the middle. Finally, a great weakness of this DE list is that it has no ranked units. His powerful stuff (dreadlords, hydras, chariots) can be successfully tanked by a ranked up unit where it hasn't been shot to pieces: they'll get kills, but they won't break steadfast units unless they're all charging the same target. You should, therefore, be able to hold up his killer dreadlords- this will provide you with counter-attacking opportunities of your own against the hydra and pegasi or, alternatively, allow you to steamroll his base of crossbowmen before he can do the same to your infantry and archers.
The Plan
Marching out into the field is just going to get you shot, redirected and then counter-charged by chariots - it's not a good plan. I think I'd deploy a heavily refused flank, here. Since this guy relies on having lots of open space to move about in to get at flanks etc, deploying in this way will deny him that and leave his vulnerable dark riders and shades just sitting infront of your shooting (make sure you fill in your back field with deployments to prevent the scout, as we discussed in
Deployment). Deploying back will give your shooting phase the edge in Turn 1, as will lore of Life, which'll be
very effective against crossbows and multiple bolts. Put the archmage in a unit needing Regeneration and you are in a position (looking at my army) to make almost all of your units resistant to his shooting: Regen on spears (for example), Stone on swordmasters, lion cloaks on white lions, 2+ AS on knights, 1+ rr AS on characters, while you can pop back lost wounds onto your repeaters to maintain your missile fire (he can't do that). Your opponent has more shots, but your range and defence (also retaking panic tests) is better - you must take advantage of this. This should force him to move his crossbows forward, placing them closer to a cavalry charge. Also, you'll have access to Dwellers Below. Indeed, your magic phase will be better than his if you're fielding an archmage - you can punish him there.
For Turns 1 and 2, priority targets are the dark riders and reapers- they're both going to be shooting your soft elves up on Turn 1 and, with fast cav
feigned flight, they're also both the biggest early threat (via shooting and redirection) to your knights. 25 archers will, on average, kill one reaper per turn. Have them do that and use your own repeaters to start clearing out dark riders (awakening of the wood is also good here and against shades). Units like the chariot, eagle, dragon princes and individually fielded cavalry characters can provide you with exclusion zones around your army, keeping the riders and shades away from your soft troops during this early part of the game. Getting these units out the way early will open up the rest of the board for your infantry and heavy armour, which, together, is more than capable of taking on his other elements: both my knights and my large spear block can take hits from crossbows, while the eagle and chariot provide decent saturation. I'd probably keep the elites further back with the archers (and ideally the prince), and have them worry about the hydra, chariots and pegasi.
'Unkillable' Dreadlords
EDIT: Having not spotted that the pendant dreadlord in this particular list was wearing the Crown of Command (with thanks to Elindar), the following will be useful when thinking about Unkillable dreadlords in general. In the example below, the dreadlord rides with dark riders, but the same would apply if he were with cold ones: kill the troopers and make him run on combat res. I've had another think about the Crown of Command dreadlord featured in the above DE list and have recorded my thoughts on him in a second post, below.
The unkillable dreadlord is a pain but there's an easy way to beat him
if he deploys with a unit of dark riders (as would seem likely to start with). Don't shoot that unit, but deploy a knight unit opposite it. As long as he's with them, they've lost the
Fast Cavalry special rule, so they can't march and shoot (one less missile threat for you to handle on turn 1 - excellent) and, more importantly, they can't
feign flight. Charge them with some knights and a tanking character (noble, Helm of Fortune, Guardian Phoenix is a good one). Tank the dreadlord's hits with the noble and kill all of the cavalry around him - you should break him on combat res, giving you a chance to run him down without needing to score a wound. Getting another fast unit in there (like an eagle) will increase the chances of running him down. If he gets away (or just flees) and rallies, he still has to spend the turn doing nothing - which is good for you and bad for him.
If the dreadlord (any dreadlord!) runs around by himself and your repeaters are free, shoot him. Multiple shots should, at close range, score two wounds per turn (might be 1.5), so it's worth a go. If there are other necessary targets available, though, I'd be tempted to take them and not worry too much about him. Ultimately, he's only 4 attacks and, in many circumstances, it'll be better to concentrate on the dangerous stuff around him rather than waste all your efforts in trying to take him down at all costs. Units like this guy earn their points by the damage they prevent as well as the damage they cause. By taking other targets with your shooting and running damage-limitation tactics, as opposed to trying your hardest to kill him outright, you can limit this character's impact upon the game.
Overview
As discussed, remember that the dark elf characters can't break steadfast so, without another unit alonside them, you'll have time to counter them once they've engaged in close combat. Using your harassment, tank characters and manoeuvreing your units well can deny him the multi-character/monster/chariot combo charge that can make them dangerous.
As for the crossbows, our tank cavalry characters are basically immune to them (1+ re-rolled save). Once I'm done clearing away chaff, I could probably pin a unit in place with the BSB and then follow up with the spearelves to avoid the
stand and shoot while running all my cavalry at the other (remember that his shorter range forces him to close with you, making him more vulnerable to an early cavalry charge). As for the prince, I think I'd rather keep him close to my archers and the elites (assuming I can get rid of the reapers), using him to cover the moves my opponent makes with his fast attack stuff. He'll eat chariots, hydras and pegasi with ease, especially with units like the lions and swordmasters alongside. Archmage stays nearby to help him and the smaller units tank damage. Pigeon plucker pendant, meanwhile, once again saves the day by making the prince extra pegasus proof, which is nice.
So, these are my initial thoughts. When I get home I'll draw up a quick map showing how I'd like to deploy - a lot would depend on where this guy places his hydra and chariots but, in principle, I'd heavily refuse a flank to best take advantage of my better range and limit his options in the movement phase. In summary; shoot the fast light stuff first, then use your characters, shooting and elites combined to take out his hard models and use your knights to run over crossbows. The spearelves will provide an excellent hard point to block his chariots or can run over crossbows, depending on how the field looks.
Hope this helps!