Ulthuan

Ok so I am going to be playing a fairly massive game against my friend over the coming weekend. We are both bringing 7,000 points, 8th edition vanilla rules, 25% Lords, 25% heroes, etc.
The one exception is we are using 4d6 for magic, simply because of the size of the game.

But to be honest, I am not really sure where to begin! I am playing against Empire and I know he only owns 2 Steam Tanks total so I am not worried about a mechanized division hitting me, but he does have buckets of knights and greatswords. I am not really going to list tailor against him, but I do need help assembling my magic item loadouts on my characters because I am going to have a LOT of characters and that means I will be stretched for choices. My basic idea is something like

Eltharion-490
Stormwing

Prince on Star Dragon-647
Blade of leaping gold
Enchanted shield
Talisman of protection
Dragon armor
Lance

Archmage-295
Book of Hoeth
Potion of toughness
Level 4, high magic

Loremaster-320
Sword of strife
Armor of destiny

Dragon Mage-430
Level 2
Talisman of preservation

Level 2 high mage-150
Scroll of shielding
Obsidian trinket

Level 2 life Mage-150
Dispel scroll
Iron curse icon

BSB-138
Armor of caledor
Longbow
Halberd

Handmaiden of the Everqueen-145
Sword of anti heroes
Potion of foolhardiness
Dragon helm

51 Lothern Seaguard-642
FC
Shields

30 archers-330
Fc

18 archers-180

14 silver helms-352
Fc
Shields

5 Ellyrian Reavers-125
Fc, bows

5 Ellyrian Reavers-125
Fc, bows

25 Phoenix guard-450
Fc, razor banner

25 Pheonix guard-420
Fc, Lichebone

40 white lions- 600
Fc, banner of the world dragon

10 Shadow Warriors -140

16 Sword Masters-208

18 Sword Masters- 284
Fc, sword of might

Eagle

Eagle

4 bolt throwers

2 Lion Chariots



Toying with the idea of a dispendable noble on an eagle to War Machine hunt or just carry the Star Lance and try to pop a tank, or maybe using a block of 10 reavers and another of 5, since a Wyssan's or Mindrazor on a 10 man unit of riders can easily turn a flank charge in a combo fight into the winning move.
As you can guess I am essentially just fielding my collection, although the numbers will be tailor for points and formation. I can go field more Phoenix Guard or Spearmen if you think that could help, maybe even more archers. I have any other type of hero, handmaidens or Sea Helms, would those be any good in a huge battle maybe? I could stick them in my spearmen and make them Lothern, possible get some real use from the reform.

Anyways, any thoughts would rock, and some inventive ways to get useful characters!

I have only once played 8000 vs 8000 game and to be honest I find those mega games to be rather dissapointing. They turned out to be like these smaller 2000 vs 2000 , 2000 vs 2000 battles that are fought simultaneously.

I take you are not going to proxy any models, so another frostie is out of question?

Here are some suggestion and comments:
- I am very fond of 20-25 men phoenix guards with razor banner. If I owned 50ish of them I would break them in to two units. I would make them advance with white lions in the middle and guarding the flanks of those axemen.
- If you are facing tons of armored cavalry bolt throwers can be your best allies. Allready have 4 of them, but you could go to 8 if you have enough models.
- Sea Helms special ability has one crucial flaw imo that you are not allowed to stand and shoot and then reform. Should that be the case that would be neat trick with seaguard or normal archers.
- Handmaiden(seahelm or any character) with reaver bow + potion of str can hurt his armored units. Especially if your opponent uses hurriculums / altars etc.
- Alith anar can do nice damage with high BS and str 7 mobile bolt thrower
- low level metal mages are really good here to push through armor.
- Tooled eagle (asf + ap) noble, star lance , charmed shield and/or crown of attrazar, having a great weapon and lion cloak from mundane itsms is really good character to have. T4 and extra wound really helps him survive smaller fires (watch out hellblasters though) and he can pop open pretty much any warmachine and give you much needed help with rear charges or can be used even as character sniper.
- I would make shadow warrior blocks smaller, unless you field alith anar. Then I would almost consider making them one big unit with shadow walker perhaps even with a sword of might or something similar
- Shadow Armor is also good item to get single character like annointed in to the enemy like. If you want to have him as war machine hunter you can give him arabyan carpet. Well that is 300 point model flying around, but could be fun to use.
- In this sizes match I might even go for wayward shard to get 30 spearmen to ambush.

----

One key thing is that bigger games tend to take tons of time. Especially if they are played with competetive mind set. I dare to claim that if you field some rather unconventional solutions, like the annointed on shadow armor and flying carpet, dragon mages, eagle units, griffon riders etc the game will be much more entertaining to both you and your opponent.

I hope you make a battle report from the big game, especially with pictures. Nothing beats the thrill of seeing many models fighting. Incase you haven't stumpled accross this Hoodling http://hoodlinghole.blogspot.fi/p/the-b ... plain.html and their 25k game and the latest empire game with 40k points. Those pictures and battle reports are just excellent to read.

_________________
High Elves since Aug 2010: Tot /W / L / D - 100 / 75 / 23 / 2
Tomb Kings since Sep 2013:Tot / W / L / D - 31 / 18 / 12 / 1

Chronicles of Loriel's Glory and Shame

I have only once played 8000 vs 8000 game and to be honest I find those mega games to be rather dissapointing. They turned out to be like these smaller 2000 vs 2000 , 2000 vs 2000 battles that are fought simultaneously.

I take you are not going to proxy any models, so another frostie is out of question?

Here are some suggestion and comments:
- I am very fond of 20-25 men phoenix guards with razor banner. If I owned 50ish of them I would break them in to two units. I would make them advance with white lions in the middle and guarding the flanks of those axemen.
- If you are facing tons of armored cavalry bolt throwers can be your best allies. Allready have 4 of them, but you could go to 8 if you have enough models.
- Sea Helms special ability has one crucial flaw imo that you are not allowed to stand and shoot and then reform. Should that be the case that would be neat trick with seaguard or normal archers.
- Handmaiden(seahelm or any character) with reaver bow + potion of str can hurt his armored units. Especially if your opponent uses hurriculums / altars etc.
- Alith anar can do nice damage with high BS and str 7 mobile bolt thrower
- low level metal mages are really good here to push through armor.
- Tooled eagle (asf + ap) noble, star lance , charmed shield and/or crown of attrazar, having a great weapon and lion cloak from mundane itsms is really good character to have. T4 and extra wound really helps him survive smaller fires (watch out hellblasters though) and he can pop open pretty much any warmachine and give you much needed help with rear charges or can be used even as character sniper.
- I would make shadow warrior blocks smaller, unless you field alith anar. Then I would almost consider making them one big unit with shadow walker perhaps even with a sword of might or something similar
- Shadow Armor is also good item to get single character like annointed in to the enemy like. If you want to have him as war machine hunter you can give him arabyan carpet. Well that is 300 point model flying around, but could be fun to use.
- In this sizes match I might even go for wayward shard to get 30 spearmen to ambush.

----

One key thing is that bigger games tend to take tons of time. Especially if they are played with competetive mind set. I dare to claim that if you field some rather unconventional solutions, like the annointed on shadow armor and flying carpet, dragon mages, eagle units, griffon riders etc the game will be much more entertaining to both you and your opponent.

I hope you make a battle report from the big game, especially with pictures. Nothing beats the thrill of seeing many models fighting. Incase you haven't stumpled accross this Hoodling http://hoodlinghole.blogspot.fi/p/the-b ... plain.html and their 25k game and the latest empire game with 40k points. Those pictures and battle reports are just excellent to read.

_________________
High Elves since Aug 2010: Tot /W / L / D - 100 / 75 / 23 / 2
Tomb Kings since Sep 2013:Tot / W / L / D - 31 / 18 / 12 / 1

Chronicles of Loriel's Glory and Shame

Thanks for the tips, bringing the fun stuff and things like that are what this is all about. That eagle Noble willll prob happen so I can have Eltharion, the dragon and him all ready to respond to threats very fast. The shadow warriors are staying at ten since I want a decent shot of them getting shot by outriders and doing something useful next turn.

EDIT I should mention that in my mind Eltharion riding a griffon is automatic, it's my favorite model.

I know what you mean about battles breaking down, but that's not an inaccurate representation of many historical large battles. You would tend to lose communication and cohesion across terrain and with thousand of troops on the field. That is why I have small blocks of cavalry and sword masters, to help me take I advantage of these gaps or lack of command over an area of the table. At least one Mage will be mounted as well, to help get important movement spell around the table quickly.

You really suggest splitting the Phoenix guard? I would most likely end up out deploying him at that point, but I'm not sure you have ever ranked up 60 Phoenix guard(the actual number I own) it's a spiritual experience. I'll consider it especially since MSU may be very good against empire and their detachments and tendency to flank big blocks.

I'm thinking of cutting the Phoenix, actually. I'm no to big a fan of the model or the fluff, but I need him to fear something other than the dragon. Thinking that between Eltharion, the dragon and a Phoenix, he should be busy enough until my shadow warriors or eagle take out his gun line.

This is a friendly game above all else, we both want to play a huge game and have it go smoothly, so I am hoping to bring a list that would actually fit the idea of an army of ulthuan. Ranks upon ranks of spearman, hordes of archers, silverhelms, a phalanx of Phoenix guard, merciless regiments of great swords, the Princes own bodyguard of White Lions taking the field with chariots on their flanks. Reavers and shadow warriors dashing around, silencing guns and staving off flank charges. Should be fun.

Actual army list submitted, any thoughts would be great the game stats later today

Soi. Have some pictures but we play on a plain table with very representative rather than realistic terrain. If anyone is interested in seeing dirty garage hammer at its worst I may post pics but not likely.

Anyways, so there is a huge complex building in the center of the map that allow the housing, movement within and protection of up to two 60 man units. In the right flank of the High Elf deployment zone there is a hill fronted, after a regiment size clearing, by a small woods equidistant to the board edge and the central building. Located directly opposite the hill there is a patch of dangerous terrain represented in the form of large boulders and scree- the only landmark in the Imperial deployment zone besides a forest slightly to the left of center, as the High Elf sees it.
Attached to the main structure, are two fences that form a parrtially enclosed yard in front of this forest by two lengths of a Steam Tank.

The deployment goes as follows- left to right, as seen from the High Elf side.

High Elf deployment:

In a deployment that essentially covers an entire six foot board I dropped my Reavers, eagles, Reaverrs, both units of swordmasters, White Lions, one unit of Pheonix guard, spears, and lastly my silver helm bus on the line. Second wave was made up of archers and additional Pheonix guard on the left flank and dragons and bolt throwers on the right behind and on the hill.

Imperial deployment saw his 40 great swords, 2 cannons 2 mortars his tank and a Celestial Hurricanum anchoring the left side of the board, as the High Elves saw it. Then a unit of 60 spears backed up by combat detachments and a block of 50 halberds right behind it chock full of characters. These two units deployed right in front of the main building. Directly across the bolt thrower encrusted hill on my right flank he deployed a massive unit of eighteen Inner Circrle knights led by Karl Franz on a horse and Luthor Huss. This unit is then supported by a unit of nine Reiksguard led by Helborg, six Demi gryphon knights, 2 cannons and ten pistoliers, in two units. Oh and three helblasters sprinkled in, right on the deployment line.

Turn one saw the Imperial forces push out slightly, merely sending pistoliers to scurry into woods, Kurt Helborg led his unit forwards eight inches, the spearman stormed at some impertinent Shadow Warriors who had deployed inside of the house. The spearman quickly slaughtered the Elven scouts as the Imperial guns spoke, causing smoke and fire to fill the air the the ground with a trembling fear. But only one. High Ell archer. Was killed. Sad. The imperial magic was expertly thwarted by Elf mastery, and soon, they were responding...

The dragons surged forward, landing just outside the forest where the pistoliers had gone to ground. The forests burned, leaving a scant four riders between two units. The Silver Helms surged forward and smacked into the flank of Helborg unit, after a useful magical push from the Arch Mage in his nearby Pheonix guard bunker. The White Lions reenacted the glorious victory from the Imperial turn on a unit of Huntsmen hiding in a different wing of that self same building. Now two huge combat unit occupy the same building and will soon by madly assaulting each other in an attempt to gain this huge advantage. Action on the left flank saw Reavers and eagle move closer to the Imperial line after their earlier Vanguard moves. One eagle managed a successful charged against a cannon, and the unit of thirty archers was able to shoot the crew of another to death. Shuffling to protect the bolt throwers with spears and swordmasters, the High Elf army had responded.

[sarcasm(just in case)] only if the players are really greasy, wearing some kind of really really old t-shirt that has (originally yellow) smile that has turned in to brown and some one is going to flip a table. [/sarcasm]

I would definately want to see the battle.

_________________
High Elves since Aug 2010: Tot /W / L / D - 100 / 75 / 23 / 2
Tomb Kings since Sep 2013:Tot / W / L / D - 31 / 18 / 12 / 1

Chronicles of Loriel's Glory and Shame

+1, i definitely want to see!