BotWD bus, 3++ PG & Dual Frost

[Sackree]

So following on from the evolution of of my Bus, single infantry block and dual frosty build that saw me get 3rd place at this years New Zealand nationals back in easter (long time I know, but study trumps toy soldiers) I have decided to make the following revisions.

White lions are pants now, there is too much ASF and shooting in the game for them. I5 and no reroll just doesn't cut it anymore as their only defense was BotWD, and this takes the banner away from the bus, making it more susceptable to death and metal magic.
Because of this I have decided to swap them out for Phoenix Guard w/ the razor banner.
Lore of Heavens does not synergize with PG as well as it does with Lions, so I have opted to go with high, to abuse their ward save. This also gives me access to walk between worlds in order to have the PG keep up with the rest of the army, as well as using lileaths blessing for +5 to cast alongside BoH.

My only other concern is the lack of board control from no bolt throwers. I am considering dropping an eagle and a frosty for 4 RBT's, but I find 1 frosty to be easy to manage, whereas 2 is just powerful.

As always, comments and criticisms are appreciated.

Code: Select all

+++ Bus, PG, Dual Frosty (2399pts) +++
+++ 2400pt High Elves 8th Ed Roster (Standard)) +++

Selections:

High Elves 8th Ed (Standard) Selections:

+ Lords + (583pts)

    * Archmage (320pts) 
        High Magic, Level 4 Wizard
        * Magic Items
            (AB) Book of Hoeth, (BRB) Talisman of Preservation


    * Prince (263pts) 
        Heavy Armor
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Lord)
            Ithilmar Barding
        * Magic Items
            (BRB) Dawnstone, (BRB) Enchanted Shield, (BRB) Giant Blade


+ Heroes + (172pts)

    * Noble (172pts) 
        Heavy Armor, Lance, Shield
        * Battle Standard
            (AB) Banner of the World Dragon
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Hero)
            Ithilmar Barding


+ Core + (614pts)

    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Silver Helms (329pts) 
        Elven Steed, Heavy Armor, High Helm, Ithilmar Barding, Lance, Musician, Standard Bearer
        * 13x Silver Helm
            13x Shield


+ Special + (450pts)

    * Phoenix Guard (450pts) 
        Halberd, Heavy Armor, Keeper of the Flame, Musician, 25x Phoenix Guard
        * Standard Bearer
            (BRB) Razor Standard


+ Rare + (580pts)

    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle

Created with BattleScribe

[Curu Olannon]

I`m a big fan of this concept but I think you lack a dispel scroll (in my opinion more crucial than BoH) as well as a second Noble. The second Noble pushes the BSB into the 2nd rank and allows you to include the all-important TOTS for those grindy fights that would otherwise be a pain.

Noble on barded steed with Star Lance, Enchanted Shield (Prince takes Dragonhelm instead) and TOTS is ~140-150 points. Degrading Book => Scroll, killing off an Eagle and shaving some PG should provide the points. Also, I would ditch the third unit of Reavers for more Helms. 13 just feels so small (ever faced OnG? You`ll lose LoS! before T3 at best).

[John Rainbow]

Also, I would ditch the third unit of Reavers for more Helms. 13 just feels so small (ever faced OnG? You`ll lose LoS! before T3 at best).

I agree with most of Curu's sentiments but can see it being a matter of playstyle somewhat as it becomes much more focussed on the bus with those changes. As for putting more SHs in I think this also does the same. The comment about OnG is also very game dependent as I think in a lot of cases you can get into CC (if you need) on T2 to mitigate the Doom Diver problem.

[Curu Olannon]

Most OnG players have goblins on wolves (heroes) to act as speedbumps. If not, they have manglers, fanatics and other shenanigans to put in your way. Chaos Dwarfs have lots of chaff as well, not to mention their roadblocks (e.g. Iron Daemon). Ogre Kingdoms put Sabretusks in your face and Empire have steam tanks. I guess I just don`t see the value in that last unit of Reavers. Personally I feel that Helms are too small when they go beneath 16 and even 17 isn`t always enough. T3 2+ really isn`t that durable.

[finreir]

So following on from the evolution of of my Bus, single infantry block and dual frosty build that saw me get 3rd place at this years New Zealand nationals back in easter (long time I know, but study trumps toy soldiers) I have decided to make the following revisions.

White lions are pants now, there is too much ASF and shooting in the game for them. I5 and no reroll just doesn't cut it anymore as their only defense was BotWD, and this takes the banner away from the bus, making it more susceptable to death and metal magic.
Because of this I have decided to swap them out for Phoenix Guard w/ the razor banner.
Lore of Heavens does not synergize with PG as well as it does with Lions, so I have opted to go with high, to abuse their ward save. This also gives me access to walk between worlds in order to have the PG keep up with the rest of the army, as well as using lileaths blessing for +5 to cast alongside BoH.

My only other concern is the lack of board control from no bolt throwers. I am considering dropping an eagle and a frosty for 4 RBT's, but I find 1 frosty to be easy to manage, whereas 2 is just powerful.

As always, comments and criticisms are appreciated.

Code: Select all

+++ Bus, PG, Dual Frosty (2399pts) +++
+++ 2400pt High Elves 8th Ed Roster (Standard)) +++

Selections:

High Elves 8th Ed (Standard) Selections:

+ Lords + (583pts)

    * Archmage (320pts) 
        High Magic, Level 4 Wizard
        * Magic Items
            (AB) Book of Hoeth, (BRB) Talisman of Preservation


    * Prince (263pts) 
        Heavy Armor
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Lord)
            Ithilmar Barding
        * Magic Items
            (BRB) Dawnstone, (BRB) Enchanted Shield, (BRB) Giant Blade


+ Heroes + (172pts)

    * Noble (172pts) 
        Heavy Armor, Lance, Shield
        * Battle Standard
            (AB) Banner of the World Dragon
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Hero)
            Ithilmar Barding


+ Core + (614pts)

    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Silver Helms (329pts) 
        Elven Steed, Heavy Armor, High Helm, Ithilmar Barding, Lance, Musician, Standard Bearer
        * 13x Silver Helm
            13x Shield


+ Special + (450pts)

    * Phoenix Guard (450pts) 
        Halberd, Heavy Armor, Keeper of the Flame, Musician, 25x Phoenix Guard
        * Standard Bearer
            (BRB) Razor Standard


+ Rare + (580pts)

    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle

Created with BattleScribe

Like the power of the list (it's pretty much the TO build now) but l4 on life or death has more power IMHO

[SpellArcher]

I agree with Curu, scroll is more important than Book and 2+ AS on BSB is a bit thin. I'd consider dropping the Banner for combat gear and mounting the AM with scroll, maybe MR3.

[Sackree]

Revised list
- scroll in for book
- combat noble added to push BSB to second rank
- eagle and 4 PG dropped to free up points.
- prince gear altered slightly.

Code: Select all

+++ cav, pg, dual frost (2398pts) +++
+++ 2400pt High Elves 8th Ed Roster (Standard)) +++

Selections:

High Elves 8th Ed (Standard) Selections:

+ Lords + (566pts)

    * Archmage (290pts) 
        High Magic, Level 4 Wizard
        * Magic Items
            (BRB) Dispel Scroll, (BRB) Talisman of Preservation


    * Prince (276pts) 
        Heavy Armor, Shield
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Lord)
            Ithilmar Barding
        * Magic Items
            (BRB) Dawnstone, (BRB) Dragonhelm, (BRB) Giant Blade, (BRB) Potion of Foolhardiness


+ Heroes + (311pts)

    * Noble (172pts) 
        Heavy Armor, Lance, Shield
        * Battle Standard
            (AB) Banner of the World Dragon
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Hero)
            Ithilmar Barding


    * Noble (139pts) 
        Heavy Armor
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Hero)
            Ithilmar Barding
        * Magic Items
            (AB) Star Lance, (BRB) Enchanted Shield, (BRB) The Other Trickster's Shard


+ Core + (601pts)

    * Ellyrian Reavers (105pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor, Musician
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Silver Helms (306pts) 
        Elven Steed, Heavy Armor, High Helm, Ithilmar Barding, Lance, Musician, Standard Bearer
        * 12x Silver Helm
            12x Shield


+ Special + (390pts)

    * Phoenix Guard (390pts) 
        Halberd, Heavy Armor, Keeper of the Flame, Musician, 21x Phoenix Guard
        * Standard Bearer
            (BRB) Razor Standard


+ Rare + (530pts)

    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle

Created with BattleScribe

[SpellArcher]

Looks good.

Maybe try and squeeze Potion of Toughness in on the AM? The PG he displaces has to sit behind the unit anyway.

[finreir]

So following on from the evolution of of my Bus, single infantry block and dual frosty build that saw me get 3rd place at this years New Zealand nationals back in easter (long time I know, but study trumps toy soldiers) I have decided to make the following revisions.

White lions are pants now, there is too much ASF and shooting in the game for them. I5 and no reroll just doesn't cut it anymore as their only defense was BotWD, and this takes the banner away from the bus, making it more susceptable to death and metal magic.
Because of this I have decided to swap them out for Phoenix Guard w/ the razor banner.
Lore of Heavens does not synergize with PG as well as it does with Lions, so I have opted to go with high, to abuse their ward save. This also gives me access to walk between worlds in order to have the PG keep up with the rest of the army, as well as using lileaths blessing for +5 to cast alongside BoH.

My only other concern is the lack of board control from no bolt throwers. I am considering dropping an eagle and a frosty for 4 RBT's, but I find 1 frosty to be easy to manage, whereas 2 is just powerful.

As always, comments and criticisms are appreciated.

Code: Select all

+++ Bus, PG, Dual Frosty (2399pts) +++
+++ 2400pt High Elves 8th Ed Roster (Standard)) +++

Selections:

High Elves 8th Ed (Standard) Selections:

+ Lords + (583pts)

    * Archmage (320pts) 
        High Magic, Level 4 Wizard
        * Magic Items
            (AB) Book of Hoeth, (BRB) Talisman of Preservation


    * Prince (263pts) 
        Heavy Armor
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Lord)
            Ithilmar Barding
        * Magic Items
            (BRB) Dawnstone, (BRB) Enchanted Shield, (BRB) Giant Blade


+ Heroes + (172pts)

    * Noble (172pts) 
        Heavy Armor, Lance, Shield
        * Battle Standard
            (AB) Banner of the World Dragon
        * Elven Steed with Barding (Hero)
            Ithilmar Barding


+ Core + (614pts)

    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Ellyrian Reavers (95pts) 
        Elven Steed, Light Armor
        * 5x Ellyrian Reaver
            5x Spears and Bows


    * Silver Helms (329pts) 
        Elven Steed, Heavy Armor, High Helm, Ithilmar Barding, Lance, Musician, Standard Bearer
        * 13x Silver Helm
            13x Shield


+ Special + (450pts)

    * Phoenix Guard (450pts) 
        Halberd, Heavy Armor, Keeper of the Flame, Musician, 25x Phoenix Guard
        * Standard Bearer
            (BRB) Razor Standard


+ Rare + (580pts)

    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Frostheart Phoenix (240pts) 


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle


    * Great Eagle (50pts) 
        Great Eagle

Created with BattleScribe

What a knowledgeable and fair guy you are, your list is in no way bent it is a players list not a 1600 point bus.
You noted that white lions and swordmasters are rubbish no asf no rerolls and no asf t3 infantry over 10 points = waste of time (playable with the banner Ofc)
You have picked a fast list i hits hard, it has dreadful match ups but they are limited or are manageable, and your list is in no way lopsided with one type of unit so much it's bent.

All that said anyone with decent firepower/magic who can't be bothered to play warhammer will probably beat it. But your statements are sound and your list is sound. I'm only kissing your arse because someone else on this forum who regularly attends tournaments agrees with me.
Good luck and please let me know how you get on as that list is so close to my original list when the new book came out I got 5th at tournament with it, without stupid painting scores 2nd, but I diced 1 guy and out thought another by a long way in 2 match ups, as I said not invincible list but damn fun. For what it's worth by the way I think heavens is better with it. Curse of midnight with frosties is good, and harmonic cav is good. Ice shard and comet as ranged defence is good, and the a use of chain lightning jumping back into combats always seems to good not to use. Well good luck mr sackree dm me your real name and how you get on in next event if you could please.