Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

Discuss your tactics for the 7th Ed army book here, together with tactics for other races.

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Aeolthir
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Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#1 Post by Aeolthir »

Hi mates!

It's me again this week.
Yesterday (Sunday) I beat the Ogres big time, thanks in great part to you guys.

This next Sunday I'll face another opponent that I dont know much about, i.e. Bretonnia.

I know they rock hard on the charge, they dont have a good shooting nor infantry and their magic is more defensive than offensive.
You surely have some advices and tips to give.

Wich unit I should take to take care of them?
Wich of their units I must avoid or I should take out first?

I tough about using Khoril with a unit of Swordmasters for stuborn and a unit of Whitelions for another stubborn unit. I do know that after the charge bretonnians knights are much less a treath. Is it a good minding?

Is the stardragon effective againts them?

Thanks!
Asur Ryan
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#2 Post by Asur Ryan »

Never played them but by the looks of their army book everything worth worrying about is sitting on a horse, so taking Teclis and a lvl 2 with seerstaff and casting beast cowers over and over should pretty much stuff them i would imagine
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pk-ng
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#3 Post by pk-ng »

avoid their grail knights if u can. they are like an all champions units. e.g any of their units can accept champions.

use great eagles / shadow warriors to redirect charges and march block

watch out for their peg knights. they are fairly powerful. 3+ AS with Str 5 on charge and T4 with W2! and their pegs are S5.

ohh and u get to go first most of the time since they will most likely pray. praying will give them a Ward Save of 6+ for S4 or less and a Ward Save of 5+ if it's S5 or more.

Knights errant are ITP ON THE CHARGE. so terror works against them.

Brets can only take lore of beast heavens, life and light i think.

their mage gives the units MR and can cast spell even if it's in the 2nd rank of the unit unless they need LoS.

they have a virtue which gives the hero/lord KB on large targets so watch out.

ward save are only for their knights. e.g grail knights, peg knights, knights errant, knights of the realm. they lose it if they FLEE. e.g from panic, losing combat, terror fear! so use psy against them!

what i usually do i sit on my border edge and shoot their knights. Curse of AA very useful and definitely take beast or metal against them. u can do some sniping and take out their heroes/lord with rule of ironing burning (5+ to cast, 2+ to wound no AS with only a 5+ ward save).

their charge range for their knights are 16" cuz of pure bred warhorse.
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Aeolthir
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#4 Post by Aeolthir »

Do they get their ward save only vs shooting?
WarpPhoenix
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#5 Post by WarpPhoenix »

Everything
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Aeolthir
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#6 Post by Aeolthir »

Damn... they will be hard to kill.

Cant kill them effectiveliy with Swormasters nor Whitelions.

What do you use??

The more I think of about it, the more I think I'll use heavy magic (beast and metal) instead of Stardragon+stubborn infantry
Wildling04
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#7 Post by Wildling04 »

Swordmasters and white lions will crack the armor and ASF is good, too but it doesn't always work thanks to the Ward. Though Brets are usually scared of them. WL are stubborn, so that's nice as well. I'd also consider our no AS blade for once. Lore of metal is good, too.
pk-ng
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#8 Post by pk-ng »

Not sure how big your army is going to be but I'm assuming it's like 2250
definitely bring some WL. not for their stubborn but for their S6. so hitting on 3s or 4s. and wounding on 2s with AS 5+ and WS 5+ u have a decent chance of killing some of 'em. even if u lose combat u need an 8 to pass which is pretty ez. the next rd is u don't have flanked or another unit coming into help u should win combat or break him.

RBTs r ur friend. shoot those knights! make sure u don't get dual charged by his knights. lance formations hurts alot. rank bonus with 10ish atks and another 10 from horses.

PGs are good for anchoring assuming you can survive the initial charge and not get smashed by combat res.

DPs and WL Chariots are great cuz it's a stand off charge to see who can estimate chargers better

one other thing i forgot to mention is errant knights have impetuous (however u spell it) which means if the knights are in range of something to charge they have to take a LD test. if they fail they have to charge but if they pass they don't have to.

ohh and watch out for their BSB i know in the first round of combat assuming their BSB isn't dead. they can get like 7 - 8 + base combat res. it's like BSB, SB, rank and this virtue + war banner.
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pk-ng
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#9 Post by pk-ng »

forgot to add that brets get FREE champions they HAVE to upgrade normal KNIGHT to a champion

and they have EXTRA heroes/lord.
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Griffon Prince
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#10 Post by Griffon Prince »

Castle your army a little bit. Deny as many charges as you can with terrain, tight deployment and march blockers. White Lions and PG(with character support like, say, a noble or two) are excellent against them. I'd bring archers for core and try to take out their fast cav units.
Beware the Peg Knights and/or Peg heroes, they need to be taken care of immediately. RBT them into the next life.
Bretts win by combo charging so use Beast Cowers to stop a unit in its tracks and let your White Lions/Swordies live a bit longer.
StarDragons eat Bretts for lunch. A Str 7 monstrosity on the flank of an all knight army is pure win. I would also bring the Starlance and Talisman of Loec to make sure your damage gets through.
Do watch out for their fighter characters though, they have some nasty abilities, especially in challenges.

Goodluck on the field of battle
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Renan
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#11 Post by Renan »

Well, If you want, you can meet their knights with ours. Yes we can't take core calvary, but the extra special slots i think makes up for it. Our knights easily match and in some cases surpass their knights. If you want to take the fight to them then stock up on knights and a lord on dragon maybe. Our magic is better as we can be more flexible than Brets, if we take book of hoeth or teclis and you can laugh at their MR. If you take a dragon you may want to pick your battles more carefully as bret characters can be a serious problem. Aside from that a Star Dragon lord can rip into knights. As for magic, take the lore of metal and cook the knights in their own armor.
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#12 Post by Musashi »

One thing I've always noticed is that Bretonnian buses tend to have substantial flanks - while they seldom come alone, having that much exposure must make them nervous, especially as our units have the movement to intercept them.
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Quasidemon
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#13 Post by Quasidemon »

pk-ng wrote: Knights errant are ITP ON THE CHARGE. so terror works against them.
Brets can only take lore of beast heavens, life and light i think.
Actually that is debated abit, because the wording for Errants is that they are immune on the TURN that they charge. So if he says they will charge that turn, they are immune to psych.

Ordinary damsels (lvl 1 or 2) can only take Lore of Beasts and Life. Lvl 3 or 4's can take Light & Heavens too.
Aeolthir
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#14 Post by Aeolthir »

Can the bretonnian player pray if he doesnt win the roll for the first turn?

Is the skeinsliver worth it?
I mean, deny them to pray and deny them their 5+ ward save could have a big effect on the game.
pk-ng
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#15 Post by pk-ng »

Quasidemon wrote:
pk-ng wrote: Knights errant are ITP ON THE CHARGE. so terror works against them.
Brets can only take lore of beast heavens, life and light i think.
Actually that is debated abit, because the wording for Errants is that they are immune on the TURN that they charge. So if he says they will charge that turn, they are immune to psych.

Ordinary damsels (lvl 1 or 2) can only take Lore of Beasts and Life. Lvl 3 or 4's can take Light & Heavens too.
doesn't terror come in before charges are declared? or have i got that mixed up the wrong way round?
Aeolthir wrote:Can the bretonnian player pray if he doesnt win the roll for the first turn?

Is the skeinsliver worth it?
I mean, deny them to pray and deny them their 5+ ward save could have a big effect on the game.
no u cannot deny them to pray because they pray before the battle beigns so a skeinsilver is not worth it.
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geoguswrek
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Re: Bretonnia... tactics to beat them!!

#16 Post by geoguswrek »

Brets are relatively simple.
Either you have a level 4 + level 2: thats metal on the level 4, spirit of the forge removing a unit in almost one go. and beasts on the level 2, with beast cowers halting a unit (which your opponent doesn't want) and wolf hunts giving you flank charges with dragon princes (you'll win these combats quite significantly).

As mushashi pointed out, brets tend for loooong flanks, so use eagles, you can do some pretty nasty stuff with facing your eagles and standing. setting up flanking charges for your units (lions, swordsmasters or DP).

Also, bolt throwers firing off six shots do quite a lot of damage, s4 = only a 6+ ward.

If you have a stardragon you should be looking to flank with it, or use it to set up flank charges with your other units, since one flank charge should be enough to break his units.

Other things to consider: don't cast at the units with damsels until you've drawn a few dice, these units have magic resistance.
The lord will be basically unkillble, try to avoid him, single bolt him or thrash him on combat res.
Don't take many champions
Grail knights have magical attacks.
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