Tactics against the Empire?

[tokolosh]

Hi all,

I have a match against the empire tommorrow and it's my first time against them.

Do you know some good tactics wich i can use against my opponent?
I know he will be fielding a helblaster volley gun, a mortar and a great cannon. Probably he will be using some flagellants to.

We will be playing 2000 points and i was thinking about the following list;

2000 Pts - High Elves Roster - Unnamed

Archmage (1#, 360 Pts)
1 Archmage @ 360 Pts
General; Level 4 Upgrade
1 Staff of Solidity
1 Talisman of Saphery
1 Folariath's Robe


Mage (1#, 165 Pts)
1 Mage @ 165 Pts
Level 2 Upgrade
1 The Seerstaff of Saphery


Mage (1#, 185 Pts)
1 Mage @ 185 Pts
Level 2 Upgrade
1 Silver Wand
1 Ring of Fury


Noble (1#, 151 Pts)
(Battle Standard Bearer) @ 151 Pts
Hand Weapon; Great Weapon; Dragon Armour; Shield; Battle Standard Bearer
1 The Skeinsliver

Archers (10#, 110 Pts)
10 Archers @ 110 Pts
Hand Weapon; Longbow

Archers (10#, 110 Pts)
10 Archers @ 110 Pts
Hand Weapon; Longbow

Spearmen (15#, 135 Pts)
15 Spearmen @ 135 Pts

Dragon Princes (5#, 215 Pts)
5 Dragon Princes of Caledor @ 215 Pts + FC
1 Banner of Ellyrion

Sword Masters of Hoeth (10#, 230 Pts)
10 Sword Masters of Hoeth @ 230 Pts + FC
Banner of Sorcery

Tiranoc Chariot (3#, 85 Pts)

2 x Repeater Bolt Thrower (6#, 200 Pts)


Great Eagle (1#, 50 Pts)


Total Roster Cost: 1996

Please feel free to critise & comment my list

[Spectre1]

Hi all,

I have a match against the empire tommorrow and it's my first time against them.

Do you know some good tactics wich i can use against my opponent?
I know he will be fielding a helblaster volley gun, a mortar and a great cannon. Probably he will be using some flagellants to.

We will be playing 2000 points and i was thinking about the following list;

2000 Pts - High Elves Roster - Unnamed

Archmage (1#, 360 Pts)
1 Archmage @ 360 Pts
General; Level 4 Upgrade
1 Staff of Solidity
1 Talisman of Saphery
1 Folariath's Robe

I like the setup though I find its a little overkill when facing the empire. The only guy this might, just might, be worth it, is against a Templar Grand Master with the Laurel of Victory, short of that not really. Also SoS, seems like a waste of points, I would take a Dispel Scroll or a Power Stone for the same cost.

Mage (1#, 165 Pts)
1 Mage @ 165 Pts
Level 2 Upgrade
1 The Seerstaff of Saphery

Classic built, but a solid built.

Mage (1#, 185 Pts)
1 Mage @ 185 Pts
Level 2 Upgrade
1 Silver Wand
1 Ring of Fury

Not sure about the math here. I come up to 175 pts, not 185. You might have 10 whole extra points. Nice built non the less. Ring of Fury should hurt lightly armoured Imperial troops.

Noble (1#, 151 Pts)
(Battle Standard Bearer) @ 151 Pts
Hand Weapon; Great Weapon; Dragon Armour; Shield; Battle Standard Bearer
1 The Skeinsliver

The Skeinsliver should prevent your opponent from getting a free turn of artillery, nice thouch.

Archers (10#, 110 Pts)
10 Archers @ 110 Pts
Hand Weapon; Longbow

Archers (10#, 110 Pts)
10 Archers @ 110 Pts
Hand Weapon; Longbow

Spearmen (15#, 135 Pts)
15 Spearmen @ 135 Pts

Not sure about the 3 core choices. I would put only 2, removing one Archer unit and put the points in the Spearelves, 15 is a little small.

Dragon Princes (5#, 215 Pts)
5 Dragon Princes of Caledor @ 215 Pts + FC
1 Banner of Ellyrion

Solid unit, but the FC is overkill, just the SB seems like the way to go, or at least remove the Musician and invest the points somewhere else.

Sword Masters of Hoeth (10#, 230 Pts)
10 Sword Masters of Hoeth @ 230 Pts + FC
Banner of Sorcery

I would to find some points and add a couple of guys in there.

Tiranoc Chariot (3#, 85 Pts)

2 x Repeater Bolt Thrower (6#, 200 Pts)


Great Eagle (1#, 50 Pts)


Total Roster Cost: 1996

Please feel free to critise & comment my list

All in all a very good list and it should perform well against the Empire. Watch out for large units of Greatsword because these guy just won't drop, and they'll eat you up with static CR.

Also the flagellants should not be much of a problem since you have a great eagle. Use there frenzie against them, and bait them to where you need them.

If you see a lot of handgunners before you pick your spells, you might want to consider a Lvl2 (maybe the one with the Seerstaff) taking the Lore of Life. Howler Wind and Rain Lord should help kepping the Sword Masters alive.

If you have the points (I just a little lazy to play with the list and find the points) consider the Sacred Incense on the BSB instead of the Skeinsliver, if you deploy him with the Sword Masters.

Hope this helps, and good luck with your battle.

EDIT : Try to post you list in the Army list thread not the tactics.

[Prince_Asuryan]

Archmage (1#, 360 Pts)
1 Archmage @ 360 Pts
General; Level 4 Upgrade
1 Staff of Solidity
1 Talisman of Saphery
1 Folariath's Robe

If you're gonna do magic, do it properly. Change all the items, especially the defensive stuff - The archmage shouldn't be in combat anyway, so don't worry about it. If he is in combat, he's not casting.

Better off with either the seerstaff or silver wand, ring of fury, and maybe a dispell scroll or two.

Mage (1#, 165 Pts)
1 Mage @ 165 Pts
Level 2 Upgrade
1 The Seerstaff of Saphery

Good, if you've got the silver wand on the Archmage

Mage (1#, 185 Pts)
1 Mage @ 185 Pts
Level 2 Upgrade
1 Silver Wand
1 Ring of Fury

Give theses to the Archmage. Jewel of the dusk is good here, and another scroll to be safe/

Noble (1#, 151 Pts)
(Battle Standard Bearer) @ 151 Pts
Hand Weapon; Great Weapon; Dragon Armour; Shield; Battle Standard Bearer
1 The Skeinsliver

Drop the skeinsliver - deploy as if you'll not get the choice of turn, and you'll be better off. Defend him, he's worth a lot - helm of fortune, guardian phoenix.

Archers (10#, 110 Pts)
10 Archers @ 110 Pts
Hand Weapon; Longbow

Archers (10#, 110 Pts)
10 Archers @ 110 Pts
Hand Weapon; Longbow

fine for min core.

Spearmen (15#, 135 Pts)
15 Spearmen @ 135 Pts

If you want competitive, don't get more than max core, or at the very least, bump these up to 20

Dragon Princes (5#, 215 Pts)
5 Dragon Princes of Caledor @ 215 Pts + FC
1 Banner of Ellyrion

fine

Sword Masters of Hoeth (10#, 230 Pts)
10 Sword Masters of Hoeth @ 230 Pts + FC
Banner of Sorcery

I'd drop the banner and give sorcery to the DP's. If the swordsies break, it's a lot of points to lose

Tiranoc Chariot (3#, 85 Pts)

2 x Repeater Bolt Thrower (6#, 200 Pts)

Great Eagle (1#, 50 Pts)


Fine

Biggest problem - you have no units. Empire are gonna be fielding 3-4 combat units, and a lot of knight and support units. You're gonna suffer quiet badly. I'm not sure where all the units have gone, but the army is far too small. I'd drop a mage and the chariot, and pick up a nice big unit of spears or Phoenix Guard.

[tokolosh]

The idea i had with this build is to choose metal with the archmage and unseen lurker and the default shadow spell on the lvl 2 (so he can make a fly move) and shoot the arch mage behind enemy lines to shut down his warmachines with transmutation of lead and destilation of molten silver and if that will fail i wont get shot up. (other units cant see me because i will be out of the line of sight arc. Never used it this way but thought i could take a change.

I will drop a unit archers to bolster my spearmen and swordmasters.

[WarpPhoenix]

See the problem with flying US1 heroes is people seem them and are like "Oh, that mage with no armour save and 2 wounds has no unit around him... OK!" and they'll spin their whole crossbow unit around and pound him for a turn, why not? The mage is worth the points to turn for, the xbows wont be killing 185 points worth of stuff in that one turn unless they have the lone mage running around.

But yeah pretty much what these other guys said, if you're going full out on magic characters you might as well give them all some offense, if you're facing an artillery army then you know you wont be in combat as often as say with warriors of chaos, and the uh, martial prowess of the empire isnt very famous ;p

You could always drop a mage, make the noble into a bsb and run him with a unit, the new unit you just made room for with the dropped mage. The chariot wont really work for anything apart from being annoying, chariots arnt really that fast considering they cant march, so not VERY effective at artillery hunting. And our chariots are mega weak so if he turns one unit of guns on it for a turn its over, another 85 points washed away without you being able to do anything about it.

I see what you're doing and I can see why you would, but unfortunately with HEs you need to be a little more concentrated on one area, making a balanced list cant really exist because our units rely to much on co-synergy to bring out their best. In fact if you drop the chariot id say put in another eagle.

The biggest red flag I see though is the banner of sorc on the unit of 10 swordmasters. If you're really going for the magic list then consider that banner your biggest magic advantage, throw it on white lions or a unit of phoenix guard.

Hope that helps!

EDIT: Yes Lore of Metal is probably your best bet, stick with that idea

[SpellArcher]

As Prince Asuryan says, not enough troops. I would definitely drop a Mage and get in at least another unit of cavalry. If you're not going 10 with the spears then make them 20 as suggested and include a magic std if you can. Again as said, Swordmasters should be bigger or drop the command and go 7.

I'd suggest keeping the first Mage. He is crying out to be given a dispel scroll, especially if you're keeping the Archmage kit-out. I like the Staff of Solidity but you obviously sacrifice some surety of spell selection.

The flying Archmage is a clever idea but after the first turn the enemy will go for him. If he gets caught he'll lose combat, break and probably be run down, despite being immune to attacks. It's a big gamble with 360 points.