Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#301 Post by NexS »

Congrats Ptolemy! well deserved :D
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#302 Post by Swordmaster of Hoeth »

Hi Ptolemy!

Congratulations! =D> I am very happy for you! And I am also glad I predicted that too! :lol:

Great stuff with the best sport award as well! Seems like great performance in general as well. Focus on these things, rather than on some idiot, as that is what really matters! I am looking forward to reading about your experiences and can't wait to see the pictures from the event. Please, pass the congratulations to your friend with DE army as his painting skills are awesome as well!

Congratulations again! =D>
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#303 Post by Elessehta of Yvresse »

Congratulations mate, painting awards are the best, I love the book idea, did you cheekily steal the idea off Grey? =P
Wait didn't you win best appearance last year with your WoC?
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#304 Post by Galharen »

Well deserved award! Amazing army, I would love to play against you someday :)
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#305 Post by Ptolemy »

Galharen wrote:Well deserved award! Amazing army, I would love to play against you someday :)
Same!
Elessehta of Yvresse wrote:Congratulations mate, painting awards are the best, I love the book idea, did you cheekily steal the idea off Grey? =P
Wait didn't you win best appearance last year with your WoC?
Openly stolen from Grey. I gave him credit for the idea somewhere earlier in the thread. Like much of what goes on in his thread, it was a stroke of genius. I decided to make mine an actual copy of the current HE army book's style. I went and bought a background image from Shutterstock that looked similar to the HE Army book and tried to match the fonts as best as I could.

I did win appearance last year as well with my Slaaneshi Warriors. I've been very lucky.
Swordmaster of Hoeth wrote:Great stuff with the best sport award as well! Seems like great performance in general as well. Focus on these things, rather than on some idiot, as that is what really matters! I am looking forward to reading about your experiences and can't wait to see the pictures from the event. Please, pass the congratulations to your friend with DE army as his painting skills are awesome as well!
You are completely right, of course. The only thing is that if I had won (or even just scored 1 more tourney point) in the last game I would have won this tournament's version of their top award, which is the Complete Hobbiest. Its a great concept. They take Battle, Sports and Paint and give each category equal weight. The player with the highest total wins it. I missed it by 1/100th of a point (Gah!). But thats fine. More motivation to play better, hand out more beers and make cheats play tighter. All to the good!
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#306 Post by solith »

Incredibly well deserved on the win, congratulations! =D>

What's even more remarkable though is how insanely quickly you manage to paint at such a high standard. It's equal parts inspiring and intimidating. :lol:
Tough luck on missing out on the other award, but it's a worthy goal to aim for next time at least.
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#307 Post by Ptolemy »

solith wrote:Incredibly well deserved on the win, congratulations! =D>

What's even more remarkable though is how insanely quickly you manage to paint at such a high standard. It's equal parts inspiring and intimidating. :lol:
Tough luck on missing out on the other award, but it's a worthy goal to aim for next time at least.
The thing with this award is that if you are 'trying' to win it, you probably don't deserve it. Its like trying to win a 'sportsmanship' award.
[quote]Tethlis: "Most GW female sculpts tend to look like a surly transgender woman of the night, and it would be nice to avoid that if possible."[/quote]
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#308 Post by Antheron »

I went to a tournament in, probably, 2000. There was a guy who was nice to everyone, and had brought cakes and things and handed them out to opponents. He came in second in best sportsman and threw a massive fit about not winning it, refused his little trophy and stormed off home.

So there really are people who try to win best sportsman, despite actually being (apparently) massive jerks.
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#309 Post by Ptolemy »

Antheron wrote:I went to a tournament in, probably, 2000. There was a guy who was nice to everyone, and had brought cakes and things and handed them out to opponents. He came in second in best sportsman and threw a massive fit about not winning it, refused his little trophy and stormed off home.

So there really are people who try to win best sportsman, despite actually being (apparently) massive jerks.
Exactly. I was stunned to get a sportsmanship award ( I was actually in a three way tie for 3rd place sports). I just stay nice, be friendly, have a good time and not take it all that seriously. Its man-dollies after all.
[quote]Tethlis: "Most GW female sculpts tend to look like a surly transgender woman of the night, and it would be nice to avoid that if possible."[/quote]
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#310 Post by Antheron »

I always feel it's a shame when people take it way too seriously.

It's a game, it's supposed to be about fun. Winning is cool, but if you absolutely can't have fun if you lose then you need to find a new hobby - because you'll ruin it for other people.

It's a bit like cheating seems pointless to me, but you still see it a lot.
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#311 Post by John Rainbow »

Great results Ptolemy. Good to see an Ulthuan-ite getting some much deserved hardware for the mantelpiece!
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#312 Post by Gandalf_82 »

Congrats mate, well earned I'd say!

What's next for you now the tournament is out of the way? Will you be adding to the army?
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#313 Post by Swordmaster of Hoeth »

Hi Ptolemy,

It is a very interesting concept, the Best Hobbyist. "Competing" in a few categories reminds me a little about triathlon or even pentathlon where you have to be good at many things together. Often people are very good players or fantastic painters but merging three different aspects takes something special too. In that case I have even more respect for your achievements! =D>

It happens sometimes that you don't win by a fraction of point but in the end if it is an inch or a mile, you wither win or not so as you say, try harder next time! You know you are capable of doing it, you are definitely going into right direction so I think that can be a great motivation in itself!

I find it interesting when you commented that if you try to win it you probably don't deserve it. I asked people, especially paint award winners, what it takes in their opinion to make the army outstanding so that they would vote for it. I don't necessarily want to tailor the look of my army (for example, why would I convert the models if I like them the way they are?) but I was curious. It is a great thing to be acknowledged and I will not deny I would like to try and give it a shot too. So I wanted an advice how to make my army look better from the point of view of my opponent or a spectator. I hope it is not falling into the category of "wanting to win too much" as I think that if you add that extra motivation to make your army look better so that you can have a chance in the painting vote it is good no matter what. You will have nice looking army and if you are good enough you may get an award as a bonus!

Cheers!
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#314 Post by Ptolemy »

Swordmaster of Hoeth wrote:Hi Ptolemy,

It is a very interesting concept, the Best Hobbyist. "Competing" in a few categories reminds me a little about triathlon or even pentathlon where you have to be good at many things together. Often people are very good players or fantastic painters but merging three different aspects takes something special too. In that case I have even more respect for your achievements! =D>

It happens sometimes that you don't win by a fraction of point but in the end if it is an inch or a mile, you wither win or not so as you say, try harder next time! You know you are capable of doing it, you are definitely going into right direction so I think that can be a great motivation in itself!

I find it interesting when you commented that if you try to win it you probably don't deserve it. I asked people, especially paint award winners, what it takes in their opinion to make the army outstanding so that they would vote for it. I don't necessarily want to tailor the look of my army (for example, why would I convert the models if I like them the way they are?) but I was curious. It is a great thing to be acknowledged and I will not deny I would like to try and give it a shot too. So I wanted an advice how to make my army look better from the point of view of my opponent or a spectator. I hope it is not falling into the category of "wanting to win too much" as I think that if you add that extra motivation to make your army look better so that you can have a chance in the painting vote it is good no matter what. You will have nice looking army and if you are good enough you may get an award as a bonus!

Cheers!
Hey there,

I didn't mean my 'not deserving' comment in regards to painting. That was more for the sportsmanship aspect of this particular award. For painting awards, there are DEFINITELY ways to improve your odds of getting an award once you have an army with the proper basic technical ability done. Some of my thoughts on it:

1) Understand the method of selection. You have to know HOW painting winners are being chosen. There are three basic ways I've seen painting awards handled. Method A is that a panel of judges secretly select their favorite army. Method B is a player's vote determining a winner. Method C is a sign up process where a detailed (10-15 minute) look at your army is given by multiple judges. Methods are also sometimes merged.

If dealing with Methods A or B....the best painted army often DOESN'T win unless that army was made with this style selection in mind. For example. In a Method A or Method B situation, there is NO chance that I leave my phoenix out of my army. He could be the most noncompetitive thing in the book and I'd still have him. This is because you need a centerpiece model that is 1) Tall and 2) Colorful. This draws spectators over to your army. If you see my display board, my Phoenix is roughly something like three feet off the table by the time you factor in the height of the board, the cliff his base goes on and the GW tree he is mounted on. People see him from across the room. Is he the best painted model in my army? Nope. Not in my opinion. For me, the best technical paint job is definitely my Prince. But a cav model in the midst of a dozen other cav models gets lost easily. If dealing with Method C...the time taken by the judges to look at the army carefully alleviates some of this.

2) Color. - Simply put...a color scheme that 'pops' wins more often. In the NE USA tournament scene. Paint scores often factor somewhat heavily into overall results. The end result of this is that many competitive gamers paint (or pay others to) their armies in a way ensure that it has a pop factor. My buddy (who won adepticon a few years ago) has a bright orange and dark green Dark Elf army. Huge contrast draws the eye and fools judges and other players alike into thinking the army looks better than it does. I don't want to seem like I'm criticizing anyone's painting but its a common thing here. So...if a competitive player can grab 23-25 of the available 30 paint points at a tournament, they are pleased. This is essential with Methods A and B above. Simply put...the guy who won second best paint behind me at this tournament would have scored in the upper middle of the pack in another local tournament because his army was a very dark blue/red scheme with charcoal. From across the room...looks like nothing. Sit it next to my bright Jade/Blue-Violet/Sky Blue elves and his army would be invisible.

3) Model selection - Go for original model choices. People want to look at models they haven't seen before...even if they are painted like crap. Well painted models people haven't seen before are marvels to gamers. Also...some models just CAN'T look good, no matter WHO is painting them. They are just horrible sculpts. Avoid using them. For instance, lots of people use Kroot Hounds as Warhounds or Flesh Hounds. Those models are terrible. You'll really struggle to make them look good. On the other hand, the Fenris Wolves from 40k look amazing even went painted with very basic drybrushes.

4) Display board - For Player's Choice especially...you need to have your display tell a story to ensure people spend time looking at it. You also need to display models sensibly. As an example...my BSB's banner flows behind her. If I positioned her on the board in a way that had her facing the viewer (say in her unit in a typical display board style), you could easily not even SEE the banner. If I don't make it easy for players to see one of my best pieces of painting in the army, that's my fault.

5) Be humble - This isn't a gimmick (well...for some maybe) but in my mind I really, really do stay very humble. I do get alot of very nice compliments and I clearly remember when I used to look at other's work in a tournament and just be awed when my stuff looked like crap in comparison (look at my PG models and compare them to my SMs...its a four year difference between the two models). No one likes a jerk. No one will EVER vote for a jerk and if you get a rep as an actual painting snob, people get annoyed with you. So....if someone wants to touch a model, don't have a coronary. If someone accidentally breaks or snaps something, be cool.

I think those are the best tips I can give besides just painting better.
[quote]Tethlis: "Most GW female sculpts tend to look like a surly transgender woman of the night, and it would be nice to avoid that if possible."[/quote]
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#315 Post by Swordmaster of Hoeth »

Hi Ptolemy!

Thanks a lot!

Some of your comments are similar to what other award winners gave me. In particular about striking colour scheme and eye-catching models. One of them told me (which is basically similar but with different words) that the models have to look good from 3 feet distance too. Sure, if you want to spend time on blending and gems it is great but if that does not make significant difference to the look from 3 feet or more then your effort might not get noticed.

Well, I guess I need to rethink a few ideas then and try to improve my painting style with more contrasting colours. I know my army looks dark from afar so this is what I plan to work on in the first place. My style does not help here unfortunately, as many small units don't really stand out as such but maybe if arranged on some nice display board they will attract attention as something different than other HE armies. Also, big banners can help a lot and I like painting them so I will do it for sure!

Thanks again for the advice! As soon as I settle down in the new place I will try to get back to painting!

Cheers!
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#316 Post by Antheron »

Hi Ptolemy,

I'm considering picking up one of those megamats. You've had it for a while now, so I thought I'd see what your impressions are after you've had some time to bed it in properly.
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#317 Post by Ptolemy »

Antheron wrote:Hi Ptolemy,

I'm considering picking up one of those megamats. You've had it for a while now, so I thought I'd see what your impressions are after you've had some time to bed it in properly.
I'm buying another in the winter theme. Amazing. The carrying case is crap though.
[quote]Tethlis: "Most GW female sculpts tend to look like a surly transgender woman of the night, and it would be nice to avoid that if possible."[/quote]
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#318 Post by Elessehta of Yvresse »

I'm a huge fan of those mats, it's just the postage cost that stops me getting one, damn things cost as much to post as they are to buy!
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#319 Post by Mireadur »

Ptolemy wrote:
Swordmaster of Hoeth wrote:Hi Ptolemy,

It is a very interesting concept, the Best Hobbyist. "Competing" in a few categories reminds me a little about triathlon or even pentathlon where you have to be good at many things together. Often people are very good players or fantastic painters but merging three different aspects takes something special too. In that case I have even more respect for your achievements! =D>

It happens sometimes that you don't win by a fraction of point but in the end if it is an inch or a mile, you wither win or not so as you say, try harder next time! You know you are capable of doing it, you are definitely going into right direction so I think that can be a great motivation in itself!

I find it interesting when you commented that if you try to win it you probably don't deserve it. I asked people, especially paint award winners, what it takes in their opinion to make the army outstanding so that they would vote for it. I don't necessarily want to tailor the look of my army (for example, why would I convert the models if I like them the way they are?) but I was curious. It is a great thing to be acknowledged and I will not deny I would like to try and give it a shot too. So I wanted an advice how to make my army look better from the point of view of my opponent or a spectator. I hope it is not falling into the category of "wanting to win too much" as I think that if you add that extra motivation to make your army look better so that you can have a chance in the painting vote it is good no matter what. You will have nice looking army and if you are good enough you may get an award as a bonus!

Cheers!
Hey there,

I didn't mean my 'not deserving' comment in regards to painting. That was more for the sportsmanship aspect of this particular award. For painting awards, there are DEFINITELY ways to improve your odds of getting an award once you have an army with the proper basic technical ability done. Some of my thoughts on it:

1) Understand the method of selection. You have to know HOW painting winners are being chosen. There are three basic ways I've seen painting awards handled. Method A is that a panel of judges secretly select their favorite army. Method B is a player's vote determining a winner. Method C is a sign up process where a detailed (10-15 minute) look at your army is given by multiple judges. Methods are also sometimes merged.

If dealing with Methods A or B....the best painted army often DOESN'T win unless that army was made with this style selection in mind. For example. In a Method A or Method B situation, there is NO chance that I leave my phoenix out of my army. He could be the most noncompetitive thing in the book and I'd still have him. This is because you need a centerpiece model that is 1) Tall and 2) Colorful. This draws spectators over to your army. If you see my display board, my Phoenix is roughly something like three feet off the table by the time you factor in the height of the board, the cliff his base goes on and the GW tree he is mounted on. People see him from across the room. Is he the best painted model in my army? Nope. Not in my opinion. For me, the best technical paint job is definitely my Prince. But a cav model in the midst of a dozen other cav models gets lost easily. If dealing with Method C...the time taken by the judges to look at the army carefully alleviates some of this.

2) Color. - Simply put...a color scheme that 'pops' wins more often. In the NE USA tournament scene. Paint scores often factor somewhat heavily into overall results. The end result of this is that many competitive gamers paint (or pay others to) their armies in a way ensure that it has a pop factor. My buddy (who won adepticon a few years ago) has a bright orange and dark green Dark Elf army. Huge contrast draws the eye and fools judges and other players alike into thinking the army looks better than it does. I don't want to seem like I'm criticizing anyone's painting but its a common thing here. So...if a competitive player can grab 23-25 of the available 30 paint points at a tournament, they are pleased. This is essential with Methods A and B above. Simply put...the guy who won second best paint behind me at this tournament would have scored in the upper middle of the pack in another local tournament because his army was a very dark blue/red scheme with charcoal. From across the room...looks like nothing. Sit it next to my bright Jade/Blue-Violet/Sky Blue elves and his army would be invisible.

3) Model selection - Go for original model choices. People want to look at models they haven't seen before...even if they are painted like crap. Well painted models people haven't seen before are marvels to gamers. Also...some models just CAN'T look good, no matter WHO is painting them. They are just horrible sculpts. Avoid using them. For instance, lots of people use Kroot Hounds as Warhounds or Flesh Hounds. Those models are terrible. You'll really struggle to make them look good. On the other hand, the Fenris Wolves from 40k look amazing even went painted with very basic drybrushes.

4) Display board - For Player's Choice especially...you need to have your display tell a story to ensure people spend time looking at it. You also need to display models sensibly. As an example...my BSB's banner flows behind her. If I positioned her on the board in a way that had her facing the viewer (say in her unit in a typical display board style), you could easily not even SEE the banner. If I don't make it easy for players to see one of my best pieces of painting in the army, that's my fault.

5) Be humble - This isn't a gimmick (well...for some maybe) but in my mind I really, really do stay very humble. I do get alot of very nice compliments and I clearly remember when I used to look at other's work in a tournament and just be awed when my stuff looked like crap in comparison (look at my PG models and compare them to my SMs...its a four year difference between the two models). No one likes a jerk. No one will EVER vote for a jerk and if you get a rep as an actual painting snob, people get annoyed with you. So....if someone wants to touch a model, don't have a coronary. If someone accidentally breaks or snaps something, be cool.

I think those are the best tips I can give besides just painting better.

this is very spot on on how painting is judged in tournaments. Generally judges dont know a dime about painting and what they really evaluate is bling.

as ptolemy said, the brightess wins.

in your case, however, not only they are the brightest, the army is simply gorgeus and tchnique is quite decent also.

i think it was a very well deserved prize for its combination of good technique, good mixing of colours and proper ultra-striking theme.
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#320 Post by TradeMark »

Just putting it out there, seeing Jay's board in it's full glory was quite a sight. Due to his storytelling idea, the board was massive- but it highlighted how important empty space can be on a board. A lot of boards end up feeling stilted and bunched up due to being a forward facing mass, but Jay's scene lends more towards telling his story rather than a straight composition display. Similar to his board last year, his incorporation of non-army elements (in this case flesh wolves, last year I believe he had some people fleeing the Slaaneshi threat through the village) really differentiated his board from the rest. That, combined with his amazing attention to detail really made the whole thing grand.

I played the DE pictured in my game 3 of the tourney, it too was gorgeous.

(this is Tom, the long haired guy with the nurgle swamp demon list BTW, give my best to Joe next time you see him!)
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#321 Post by lost user 6 »

Long time leaker here!

Can't believe no one has asked, do you have a recipe for your stunning painting??

Thanks

S
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#322 Post by Ptolemy »

TradeMark wrote:Just putting it out there, seeing Jay's board in it's full glory was quite a sight. Due to his storytelling idea, the board was massive- but it highlighted how important empty space can be on a board. A lot of boards end up feeling stilted and bunched up due to being a forward facing mass, but Jay's scene lends more towards telling his story rather than a straight composition display. Similar to his board last year, his incorporation of non-army elements (in this case flesh wolves, last year I believe he had some people fleeing the Slaaneshi threat through the village) really differentiated his board from the rest. That, combined with his amazing attention to detail really made the whole thing grand.

I played the DE pictured in my game 3 of the tourney, it too was gorgeous.

(this is Tom, the long haired guy with the nurgle swamp demon list BTW, give my best to Joe next time you see him!)
Thanks man! I do recall your army as well, very cool concept! I will send my best to Joe for you. It's a relief to know that the board accomplished the story I was trying to tell. For me, its always about the story of the army. I like the diorama aspect of army building. Same with the Slaaneshi stuff from last year. Grab that inspiration, cling to it and go!
Snowman wrote:Long time leaker here!

Can't believe no one has asked, do you have a recipe for your stunning painting??

Thanks

S
Hey there! I'm not sure what specific recipe's you mean. I do have some standard methods for achieving certain looks or textures (like jade, bone, flesh, etc). Do you mean more generally?
[quote]Tethlis: "Most GW female sculpts tend to look like a surly transgender woman of the night, and it would be nice to avoid that if possible."[/quote]
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Re: Ptolemy: Back from Unplugged GT with a pair of awards!

#323 Post by Sarcon »

I think he means you paint clean in a bit of a comic style, use colours that go well with blue and are mostly on the "cold" side of the colour circle and that you spent good time and effort on your bases. Works like a charm and you really did one hell of a job too! Keep it up, I really like your work, and congratz on the win!
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