New to miniature gaming and in need of some guidance

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Which army should I start with?

Poll ended at Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:30 pm

High Elves
0
No votes
Lizardmen
0
No votes
Dark Elves
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 0

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Athrenax
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Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2016 7:18 pm

New to miniature gaming and in need of some guidance

#1 Post by Athrenax »

Greetings, brethren! I am new to miniature gaming and need some help in getting started. I have not yet decided which army to start with, and I have some questions that I hope you can answer to hopefully leave me better equipped to make a decision. High Elves is of course one of the armies I am considering, along with Lizardmen/Seraphon and Dark Elves. I realize posting here may get me some biased answers, but even if they are, hopefully you will still answer guide me in the right direction with the information you give me anyway. If this is the wrong place to ask this, please feel free to point me to the right place!

There are three major points that are important to me in my choice of army, which I will describe in more detail below. What I am wondering then is how high elves compare to my other options on these points, and whether they would be a good choice for me with these requirements in mind.

One important thing to note is that I want to dabble in multiple editions, including 6th, 8th and Age of Sigmar, without having to use a different army for each edition. Wanting to play multiple editions influences more than one area, but the main thing this affects is the models available. While I am not averse to buying some models online, I would like to be able to get most of my models in stores, especially when starting out. From what I've gathered so far, all the models from previous Lizardmen army books are still available as Seraphon models in Age of Sigmar, either in local stores or the official GW webstore, while the High Elf core units from previous editions are no longer available with the switch to AoS. Am I correct on these two points (Lizardmen are safe, High Elves core units are trickier), and are there more units/models for either of these armies (Dark Elves included) that have been discontinued? Is there an easy work-around to get into High Elves for multiple editions even though the old core units are gone? Of course, I realize I will have to get square bases for my models to play them in Fantasy, but can I still use them in Age of Sigmar without rebasing them?

The second major point is that of play style and strength. I am not planning on playing this competitively, but I do want an army that won't just get destroyed by every opponent. More importantly, I want an army that offers varied gameplay and can play different strategies. This could be achieved by having a wide selection of units to choose from to deploy in different games. Even better would be if the standard units were versatile enough to be able to pivot to a completely different strategy in the middle of a game! I don't know if this is something that is possible with any army, but if there is one that is capable of this, it would be perfect! The strength of the army compared to others is something I could see easily changing between editions, so I hope there is someone who have experience with both newer and older Warhammer that can answer this.

My last major requirement is that I need to be happy about the aesthetics of my army. There isn't really any objective answer that you can give me here, but this is what has led me to exclude the human, dwarven and ogre armies, because I find them rather dull. I have also more or less excluded Vampire Counts because I don't want to paint and play ranks upon ranks of skeletons. I want units with some strong colors, either through ornate elven armor and weapons or their skin/scales like the lizardmen. I also want my models to look menacing, again either because of impressive armor or because they are bad-ass monsters. I am not really a fan of the straight-up hairstyles of the Dark Elves, but if I can choose heads with either other hairstyles or helmets for all or most of my models, that is not a problem.

Lastly, a minor point is the price. I realize this is not a cheap hobby, and I expect to have to spend quite a bit on it. I would however like to limit the spending to a degree, so if any of these armies are significantly more expensive than the others on average, that is also something I would take into consideration. I don't know what causes a certain army to be more expensive than an equivalent one from another faction, other than needing more different kits of models, but if someone has some insight here it would be more than welcome!

I think this should cover most of my thoughts and questions, and I hope that there are some more experienced players than me here who can answer some of them! Any answers or other tips are most appreciated!
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Prince of Spires
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Re: New to miniature gaming and in need of some guidance

#2 Post by Prince of Spires »

Hi Athrenax. Welcome to the forum. You're in the right place for your questions. Let me see if I can help you a bit. Before I start, a small disclaimer. My knowledge is mainly based on 8th ed. Warhammer and I only have some basic knowledge of 6th ed. and of AoS. But I'll start with my thoughts and then others here can supplement where needed.

As far as buying models goes, the main problem for HE is the core range of the models. Most of this has been discontinued. And, since they're fairly generic models (archers, guy on horse, guy with spear), I don't think they will be replaced by something new. The rest of the HE line is fairly new and will probably remain available for a decent time. People sometimes use either Dark Elf or Wood Elf models to stand in for HE models. WE have some great archer models, and I think they are still available. DE mainly offer guys with spears I think. They also have archers, but those carry crossbows. So you would either have to accept that they have a different weapon then listed on their profile (ok from a rules perspective, but if aesthetics matter a lot then it might be less so for you) or you would have to find a bunch of bows somewhere. From the look of the models, the WE ones fit better in the HE range then the DE ones, at least in my opinion.

Model wise, Lizardmen indeed have a more complete range still. There is of course no knowing what GW might do. But for now I'm assuming that they intend to keep what they have now. Of course, Lizardmen in general have a more exiting and distinct range, where even skinks are original enough compared to a generic elf with spear.

Bases should not be too much of an issue. AoS used to allow square bases, on the basis that you then would be allowed to use your old models. Bases as such seem to matter less in AoS then in WH. Of course, as long as you're not planning on playing any tournaments then things will probably even out.

Style of play wise, HE vary a lot. 8th ed elves offer a lot of different playstyles, especially if you're not going for a super competitive army. You can go combined arms, magic heavy, cavalry bus, lord on dragon, monster heavy etc. For 6th edition elves, I think there was only really one competitive build you had for elves, which was all mounted. Core full of Silver Helms, mounted general, that sort of idea. As for AoS, I think most of the models can be used in competitive lists. Phoenix guard are a strong choice, Swordmasters if used correctly, the dragons are very strong. So there you would be good to go. An issue could be that in AoS HE have been chopped up into small subfactions, which on their own don't offer a lot of options. You have the Eldritch Council, Phoenix Temple, Lion rangers and so on. Each of these only have 2-4 models in them. Of course you can combine these. But it might be something if theming is important to you.

Aesthetics is very personal and I find it difficult to advise you on that. I chose HE because I liked the model range and the lore. In the end you'll spend a lot of time assembling and painting your models. And in my view you then better like the models you're putting together. After all, who wants to spend hours working on ugly models. HE are well suited to bright colors and lots of variety. Have a look at our painting and modelling section to see what's possible.

The cost of the army generally comes down to the average number of points per model (or perhaps more accurate $ per point). The cheapest HE model (in 8th ed) is a spearman (-elf?) at 9 pts. And you quickly go higher then that, with special infantry at 13-15 pts. To compare, the cheapest model for skaven is 2 pts. In general bigger models are more "efficient" in terms of $ per point. A HE dragon for instance costs €43,- which is expensive. But in 8th it can come in at 625pts (or even higher). Which means it's about 7cts per point. A unit of 5 Dragon Princes costs €26 and comes in at 145 pts, which gives about 18cts per point.

From this perspective Lizardmen can be fairly cost efficient. Load up on the bigger monsters and you'll end up with high points for fairly limited cost. I'm not sure how efficient the army will be. And if you want to try multiple play styles you will need more models. For instance, to be able to play most of the HE playstyles I mentioned earlier at 2000-2500pts I have about 4000pts worth of HE models. Of course, you don't need to collect these all at once. You start with a set of models and expand from there as you want to try different playstyles.

I hope this helps a bit in searching for the right army for you. Please let me know in case you have any questions.

Rod
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Athrenax
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Re: New to miniature gaming and in need of some guidance

#3 Post by Athrenax »

Hi Rod! Thanks for taking the time to answer so thoroughly! Based mainly on the availability and diversity of the lizardmen models, as well as the absence of suitable starter kits for the other alternatives, I chose to make some scaly new friends, and am currently assembling my first models :D I am still interested in painting some elves somewhere down the line, what with AoS letting me mix and match armies within the same alliance, so don't be surprised if you see me around here again! Thanks again for your input!
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Prince of Spires
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Re: New to miniature gaming and in need of some guidance

#4 Post by Prince of Spires »

You're welcome Athrenax. Glad I could help a bit. Feel free to post some pictures of your Lizardmen models here on the forum. We might be a bit elf focused, but we're also very enthousiastic about the hobby in general. And always love to see more assembled / painted armies. And while I don't know much about playing Lizardmen, I have a decent understanding of the game in general. And we have some very experienced players here who also know a lot about playing Lizardmen. So if you have any gaming questions, we'd be happy to help out.

Rod
For Nagarythe: Come to the dark side.
PS: Bring cookies!

Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 167/33/91

Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
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